Confusion in the Come-on: Racial Assumptions in Random Places

confusion-newby Special Correspondent Wendi Muse

From the annoying “hey shorty” and vulgar comments about my pouty lips to the more polite “Good morning, beautiful,” catcalls are a nuisance. Much like stereotypes, even the so-called “positive” ones can be frustrating and equally as demeaning as they reduce one’s existence solely to the physical. In addition, they remind those on the receiving end of the comments or calls that they are there for the speaker’s visual—and in some extremes, physical— indulgence. Despite whatever clever or biting retort the receiver of the comments or calls may deliver, the person is still only reacting, not having delivered the initial blow that can have long term effects on one who is often subjected to engaging in such an unwarranted exchange of words.

Yet beyond catcalls and more public displays of adoration, there is the party approach. More intimate and certainly holding more potential, being approached at a party makes the stakes go up a bit. The possibility of seeing this person again or something real developing from a conversation, even if it just means a good friendship, is far more likely in this case than in an exchange with some stranger on the corner or someone ogling you on the train.

The negative side of this is that in the development that comes from this closer contact, there’s also more of a likelihood for things to get deeper in a way that is far less enjoyable. One of those uncomfortable topics for me is race.

I’ve written about this before— from being mistaken for other ethnic or racial groups to being mislabeled and forced to defend my own heritage both here and in other countries. In other words, it happens a lot. Questions like “What are you?” “Are you certain you’re not____?” and “Are you part______?” come up all the time, contingent on little phenotypic changes like my hair, my skin color, and facial features to even more superficial things like my makeup choices, my accessories, and my outfit. Going further, however, even things like my speech pattern, education level, and group of friends can contribute to the outside world’s determination of which ethnic/racial group(s) I belong for the day. As frustrating as this may be, it’s telling of something that extends far beyond a mistaken identity. It’s also a testament to the changing way we determine racial groupings in this country—particularly in ways we often attribute to other countries but rarely give thought to our having used in our own.

At a show/party I attended recently, someone used the ambiguous race topic as a segue into a compliment of sorts, if you want to call it that at all. After jokingly pointing out that I was the only black chick and one of the few black people at the party, noting that the exceptions were the bouncers and one of the performers, the person to whom I was speaking looked at me and said, “What? There is NO WAY you are all black! I mean, look at you.” And then went on to tell me how I pretty I was, not recognizing that following a comment on how I don’t look all black with a comment on my level of attractiveness was a little . . . poorly timed?

I often give people the benefit of the doubt, and I did in this case as well, recognizing that sometimes people don’t realize what they’re saying until after it has already come spewing from their mouths, now impossible to return to its rightful owner. I made my usual joke about being the end result of a long line of folks who fell under the category of “slavery era remix” (my nice way of hinting at plantation rape without all the historical baggage) in order to let my social suitor off the hook, knowing that if this didn’t happen ALL THE TIME I’d have been ill-prepared.

While there is certainly privilege that comes with looking a certain way and falling a certain place on the color spectrum between white and black, including but not limited to greater social acceptance, coming closer to the ideal standard of beauty, and even subsequent socio-economic benefits, these types of interactions make me wish that my place on race line were a little bit more defined in a visual sense. All the questions and classification guessing games get old. The reality is that despite being classified (and usually self-identifying) as black, many people of African descent living in the United States who possess lighter skin tones and features that veer closer to whiteness have historically been afforded greater opportunities and more of a chance at social mobility. This privilege has had its limits of course, but it does exist in ways we sometimes forget because we use “black” as such a blanket term, allowing for little statistical differentiation and thus analysis of the variance of opportunities between the subcategories among black Americans.

What also puzzles yet fascinates me is that the way people read my race is how much of a role class, education levels, and other signs of assimilation or association with whiteness, if you will, factor into my “not possibly being all black.” I wonder if my accent more easily offered to the listener my location of origin or fit into a stereotype of what black people supposedly all sounded like, would my race then be easier to determine (at least once I opened my mouth)? Or if I remained silent and dressed a certain way—less “hipster” and more “hood”— would I then all of a sudden gain more “black” points?

This issue has been drawn into the national forefront countless times with comments surrounding Obama’s success and its connection to his ability to string together potent sentences (wait, an articulate person of African descent, you say? GASP). Certainly, being well-spoken helps win an election, but so do many other factors, like personality (George W. Bush being a perfect example here—not well-spoken, but seemingly someone with whom you could go out for beers after work and catch a football game).  While such comments are overly simplistic and insulting, they point toward the greater issue of life opportunities and factors that have little to no relation to appearance lending themselves to an interpretation of one’s racial and/or ethnic background (many of those who hint that Obama’s success is assimilation-based are also quick to point out that his claim to “blackness” is empty as his mother is white).

We often attribute this social practice of whitening someone on the basis of his or her educational or class background, romantic partner, or occupation to nations that have long acknowledged their multiracial heritage (though with a clear preference for whiteness) for the sake of promoting national unity. The most notable examples considered in these discussions on racial classification beyond the United States deal with those that are closest—the countries of Latin America and the Caribbean. However, this practice is one I have witnessed people in the United States utilizing more frequently in recent years, especially in their interactions with multiracial people and/or people who may identify as “monoracial” (for political purposes or otherwise) who do not necessarily fit the physical and personality-based stereotypes and expectations the observer may hold.

I find it to be a humorous phenomenon, particularly considering that where I grew up and within my family and many others, people who share an appearance similar to mine are rarely assumed to be far beyond whatever their monoracial category would be (in my case, black) simply because there is not enough racial and ethnic diversity in the area to assume anything otherwise. The human mind, in its attempt to categorize, to box, to create a neat space for a clear answer to its inquiries, is far simpler than it seems. People in the United States do not yet seem fully able to account for all those spaces of ambiguity without attempting to exoticize them. And on the opposite end, there is an equally limited ability to process information beyond the norm, the ready-made categories, even if said information may fit rightfully there (i.e. someone can identify as a member of one specific racial group while possessing a phenotype generally associated with another—an aspect of self-identification that seems to always be forgotten).

I wait in anticipation for a time when there is be adequate space for us to discuss the lines that are not so clearly drawn, the areas of identity that exist in boxes of dotted lines. Beyond discussion, I look forward to a societal realization that the racialized world in which we seem to be stuck—one that is constructed for us, by us, and that we accept and then go on to apply to others—is fabricated. Just as the guy from the party’s comment was rife with ignorance, then so too is our society’s relentless reliance on stereotypical physical traits and behavioral characteristics to pinpoint race. And as our population grows increasingly more diverse (and that diversity is to be accounted for in better ways during this year’s census), hopefully our society will learn to make more room for the otherness that doesn’t quite fit its expectations without accounting for it by way of racist assumptions on beauty, class, education levels, and other more superficial characteristics.

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  1. links for 2010-02-10 « Embololalia on 10 Feb 2010 at 2:07 pm

    [...] Confusion in the Come-on: Racial Assumptions in Random Places I’ve written about this before— from being mistaken for other ethnic or racial groups to being mislabeled and forced to defend my own heritage both here and in other countries. Questions like “What are you?” “Are you certain you’re not____?” and “Are you part______?” come up all the time, contingent on little phenotypic changes like my hair, my skin color, and facial features to even more superficial things like my makeup choices, my accessories, and my outfit. Going further, however, even things like my speech pattern, education level, and group of friends can contribute to the outside world’s determination of which ethnic/racial group(s) I belong for the day. As frustrating as this may be, it’s telling of something that extends far beyond a mistaken identity. It’s also a testament to the changing way we determine racial groupings in this country—particularly in ways we often attribute to other countries but rarely give thought to our having used in our own. (tags: race usa african-americans bodypolitics) [...]

Comments

  1. Eva wrote:

    Great post. I think the problem is that the media shows these stereotypical characteristics of people. So when you don’t fit that stereotype it freaks some folks out.

    In 1995 my mother was a juror on a civil case. One day the judge called her into her chambers, w here the judge and the two attorneys were. The judge asked my mom, about “her ethnicity.” Now my mother is black but often gets mistaken for Italian/Hispanic/Jewish. My mom however doesn’t get why this happens, she doesn’t see why people can’t tell she is black. So when the judge asked her Mom said, “I’m black!” The end.

    My mom was raised in the South during the second world war and in her neighborhood, there were plenty of black people who looked just like her so she doesn’t get why people in New York City don’t get that. And I say it’s because of the stuff we see in the media as to what black is and isn’t.

  2. a. rahman ford wrote:

    i like this. i have green eyes and when i’m complimented on them i have no idea how to respond. now i just say “thank you” because i know they mean well. but i don’t think you are waiting for a space to discuss these issues. you’re doing it right here, right now through your writing :)

  3. Deaf Indian Muslim Anarchist wrote:

    I can totally relate to those thinly veiled racist insults (or “compliments”) that you get at parties, Wendi.

    I’ve often been asked (by everyone, black, white) if I am half-white because I’m ” too cool” to be 100% Indian, because apparently, 100% Indians can’t be punk rockers, have shaved mohawks, wear leather and spikes, and Doc Martens. I find it really offensive and patronizing.

  4. Ameeran Khan wrote:

    @DIMA

    What fools, next time you meet them tell them to leave their ignorant, orientalist stereotypes home.

    I have faced similar remarks but not (usually, at least) for the reasons you mentioned, you see I don’t fit in their head what they think means “to look Indian” (which is usually to to look like Kal Penn, Sendhil or Parminder Nagra) I am 100% Indian (Marathi and Punjabi to be exact) and very fair-skinned and green eyed girl and to them I couldn’t possibly be Indian you see, all of us look the same there is no diversity of looks in India! I must be lying (?) or mixed *eye roll*. Unfortunately some Indians think that there is a way to look Indian too, look at Indians from North-Eastern States with usually Epicanthic eyelids are treated in the North, it’s sick.

  5. Medusa wrote:

    Yeah… I am in Ghana now and have had several people ask me if I’m white because of the way I speak (North American, as in United States of America type of accent). Huh?

    (In case it wasn’t clear, I am fully Ghanaian and appear so.)

    I also get people asking me if my dad is Japanese when they find out that my family lives in Japan and I grew up there. However, unless they know that about me they never, ever assume I am anything but black, then I get those “compliments” on how well I speak as though that’s something beyond the realm of possibility for us Negroes.

  6. wendi muse wrote:

    i am glad to see this happens to other people too! i really do try to let people off the hook, so to speak, because i agree, eva, that so many of the media images of people of color are monolithic and not representative of the diversity within those groups that are deemed “monoracial” (when they clearly are not…we just like to categorize things that way for…simplicity?).

    i can definitely identify with the bit you (eva) wrote about your grandmother as well. as i mentioned in the piece, in the south, people who look like me and my family are common. i feel like there may need to be some more research done on this, but part of me wonders how skin color played out during the great migration north…were those of darker skin in search of better opportunities beyond the south because of increased discrimination? this is not to say the light skinned people didn’t catch heat in the south (i have many a tale from my family members, even to this day), but i think that plus the influx of caribbean and subsaharan african immigrants to the northeast may have also skewed the perception of what “black” means in terms of looks.

    overall though, the media plays a big role in this. the majority of people who look like me out there in films/tv/magazines are biracial (in this case, i’m meaning one black parent, one parent of another racial group).

  7. Olivia wrote:

    Ignorance, ignorance, ignorance

  8. Cassie wrote:

    Oy. I’ve had an ex say “Man, I just think of you as Puerto Rican” when I made a statement that mentioned my being black. I understand that’s what he thought upon LOOKING at me for the first time, but upon learning my actual mixed heritage…is it just disregarded because it doesn’t fit his visual framework? *smh*

  9. Just A Thought wrote:

    I try not to make any assumptions about anyone, and I do not query someone about their background unless they bring it up. I know how insulting and infuriating it is to have someone try to squish you in a box and think it is a compliment. (Yes, I’m black, black black, and no I am in no ways Latina or mixed. I’m proud of being black [American black], and being anything different is not an upgrade. Furthermore, you do realize that if I were a member of said nationality/ethnicity, I would still get discriminated against because I am black, and that your limited definition of what black is says more about you than it does about me.

    It did take me a while to not want to punch someone in the face when they said this. And, I had to unlearn bad behaviors about inflicting this injury on others. Once I moved to FL, I found that people I would have coded as black growing up were often something else. Moving out of my segregated and roughly culutrally homogenous hometown down to FL, my definitions of the neat little racial categories I was used to had to change.

    @ Cassie:

    I’ve had that too. Dated a guy for two years, and he insisted that I must be mixed the entire time we dated.

  10. Just A Thought wrote:

    @ Wendi:

    It’s very interesting that you wondered if southern migration of darker blacks up North, plus the influx of Caribbean and African blacks to the NE meant to the perception of blackness.

    I’ve had the opposite happen. Coming from the Midwest, where it was no big deal for people who “looked white” to identify as black (as in all black), it surprises me how many times medium brown people are coded by strangers/others as mixed or non-black. It’s sad, but a friend of mine went to my hometown (after many discussisons of why it was upsetting for people to dismiss the way that I self-identify) and remarked that she understood, because the people were lighter shades of brown, of why I didn’t “see” blackness the way our other associates did.

  11. Deaf Indian Muslim Anarchist wrote:

    in high school, I became friends with this Jewish girl (who was white, just to clarify). I had assumed that all white people were Christian.

    she was gone one day and the next day at lunch, I asked her where she was. She said she was out for Hanukkah celebrations.

    I replied: wow, you’re Jewish?

    her: yes.

    me: you don’t look Jewish so I didn’t know you’re Jewish.

    her: (laughing) what the hell does that mean, I don’t look Jewish? there’s no such thing as looking JEWISH.

    me: well I thought all Jews have dark hair and hooked noses… you’re blonde and…

    her: (blank stare)

    I felt really stupid and embarrased, but I learned something from it.

  12. Shannon wrote:

    I can definitely relate to this article. My ancestry is african american,egyptian, and louisiana creole. I often receive backhanded compliments about the way that Ilook, speak and behave being proof of my not being “really black”. I find it extremely aggravating that ignorant stereotypes are in this society associated with a particular race. I have a low tolerance for ignorance so I typically call people out on their comments.

  13. Natasha wrote:

    @Dead Indian Muslim Anarchist and Ameeran Khan

    I get y’all. I am Indian as well and have gotten those ignorant comments. I am super fair skinned (sometimes mistaken Northern European ancestry) and have light hazel eyes. Most people don’t think I am Desi unless I tell them so when I do tell them they’re reaction is usually “Oh, but you look so white!” in a tone as if it is a compliment. Ugh. (Funnily enough I have never had Desi person mistake for anything but Desi)

    There is no singular way that person “looks Desi” or any Iranian or Lebanese or Japanese or Turkish or insert-any-other ethnicity-here. So stop stereotyping what people are supposed or not supposed to look like and if they don’t fit your way of what people of their ethnicity are supposed to look like don’t “compliment” them. IT’S INSULTING.

  14. EvilAngelfish wrote:

    Sometimes, it is easy to brush things off (e.g. in Japan, I used to get this all the time: ‘You speak Japanese so well! Are you part Japanese?’ Answer: No, I just studied it for 6 years). Other times, like when someone follows a ‘compliment’ like ‘Oh, you’re so well-spoken/attractive/accomplished’ with ‘What are you’ or “Are you mixed?’, it’s difficult to take it as anything but an insult. Comments like that (and what Wendi’s friend said to her) cut me to the core.

  15. miga wrote:

    This article was great. Thanks for writing it! I really don’t have anything more to add, except to preach to the choir and say “allow everyone to self-identify!”

  16. Sonnyboy wrote:

    Good post. I think that these insults just reveal so much about what traits we associate with certain ethnicities.

    I am black, both parents black, although I have racially mixed grandparents–one white parent and one black or Indian parent. However, I think I look conventionally black. I am mid brown in skin tone, but have longer wavy hair.

    My entire life experience is being told by white people how pretty or beautiful I am “for a black girl” and black people questioning me about the extent that I am mixed or an odd offshoot of that…extreme jealousy that while I look black I somehow benefit from the “white girl dippen in chocolate” look.

    And its always been disconcerting how free people feel to tell you this/or question you about the way you look.

  17. SickofIt wrote:

    Im mixed and get so tired of the “girl, what are you mixed with” comments i get. I actually heard that at the bus stop about an hour ago and its SO obnoxious. So really…i understand where you’re coming from!

  18. Lyonside wrote:

    I’ve had 2 incidents in the last week since starting substitute teaching – one common, and one unique.

    The common one was in a HS class, with a student bellowing out for no apparant reason, “You Hawaiian?” To which I just shook my head and kept talking. I’m still learning classroom management techniques and a lot of things I just ignore since I dont’ have the authority of a regular teacher. But I felt like going, “How long had you been saving that one, and really, that’s the BEST you can come up with?”

    I also freely admit that I’m trying to cultivate the aura of a hard-ass, since subs tend to get walked on if they show any sign of insecurity. To wit, I will request that they take their seats, I make them stay in the room once they enter, etc.

    So the second incident was when (another class, same day/school) a young lady came in and grabbed a seat, but decided to jump up and stick her head out into the hall and bellow to a friend. I told her to please take her seat and I then shut the door. The kid’s comment? “Oh, she’s too white! All strict and all!”

    The regular teacher in that class is white. The makeup of that class was about 95% black. I’m black/white biracial and look really ambiguous. It makes me wonder how “white” became “strict” in their book. Of course I ignored the comment like the other one. But it was definitely something I hadn’t heard before.

  19. urbia wrote:

    Okay, I’m not even mixed, but I get people coming up to me and saying I look like a certain Asian ethnicity. “You’re Chinese? But you look so Korean!” It’s annoying as hell.

  20. ashlynn wrote:

    I feel you, Wendi. I deeply dislike speaking with people, mentioning where I’m from, and having them give me that surprised little “Oh!” which translates to, “Wow, I didn’t know black people could ’speak so well!’ ” Inm the school I work at now, people often ask questions like the ones you posed because many don’t realize that Latin people can look phenotypically black(duh). I will admit that I’ve asked myself, but as a person of color you learn to discriminate between someone asking where you’re from simply out of conversation, and confusion due to the inability to immediately classify you, which is to stereotype you, which is to fit you into their mold to assert some sort of privilege over you. Great writeup.

  21. RCHOUDH wrote:

    Both the American educational system and mainstream media is to blame for this inability of people to “think outside the box” so to speak when it comes to trying to racially/ethnically categorize people into neat little boxes so you don’t feel “threatened” by people that you can’t necessarily categorize. Another annoying characteristic of people categorizing others is when they think it’s ok to box and label people of different regions based on the most well known categories of that region. So for example you have people thinking all Latinos are “Mexicans”, all Middle Easterners are “Arabs”, all East Asians are “Chinese” and all South Asians are “Indians”. The worst part is when people refuse to understand that there are highly diverse cultures within these regions that they are ignorant about because they refuse to again “think outside the box”.

  22. Jenna wrote:

    I really appreciate you sharing your experience. I work with people of all cultures and try to teach the kids I work with that the outside doesn’t matter. It’s what’s inside that counts. Of course people get curious as to where a person originates from, ethnically. In the case of being alienated or “called out” on how you look and immediately classified, I believe that is a case of ignorance to the feelings of the persons involved. Way to make someone feel different, where everyone is just there to have a good time. As for those who say that you must be part white, you hit the nail on the head with the GW analogy. I’m embarrassed to be white when I hear things like that. I look at people from the inside out. I have worked with many disabled adults and am really getting sick of people throwing around the word “retarded”. Do they think they are better? They aren’t! I’ve met retarded folks with way more insight and compassion than most politicians.

  23. Christie wrote:

    I will have to talk to my son more about this. He’s 15 and mixed white and Indian (he looks clearly Indian or middle-Eastern, with light skin, and thinks of himself as British, Indian and a bit American), and he goes to school with mostly East Asian kids. The other day they played a basketball team from another school, and there was a very “typically” Indian-looking guy on the other team, so my son’s classmates started saying “There’s your cousin,” etc. My son was curious and in the locker room finally asked, “Where are you from?” The other boy said “Holland”.

    Unfortunately, one of my son’s white classmates was there and shouted, “You don’t look Dutch at all!” My son asked in a normal tone, “Are you 100% Dutch?” The other boy said, “No” and left the room. :( I mentioned something of the problems with the situation to my son afterwards, but will have to talk more about it with him soon.

  24. Brenda wrote:

    Yeah. I bet that it can be annoying. A few years ago, my sister and I happened to be in a Puerto Rican neighborhood and were asked if we were Puerto Rican. Mind you, I’m cinnamon colored and I was wearing an African printed head scarf. I was also asked by a classmate if I was Dominican or asked by an African guy where I was from. When he told me I look like someone from his country, I responded by saying that I’m American, which I am. His response: they’re all the same. My response: unflattered nervous laugh.

    I can definitely say that living in New York for the past few years, it’s definitely difficult to tell what many people are. Someone you think is one could thing could be a mix of three.

    In my experience haven’t heard someone say, “Well, you’re pretty for a _____”. How degrading! Why can’t someone just be pretty?

  25. Kate wrote:

    @Jenna:

    I’m sure that you mean well with telling the kids you work with that what’s on the outside doesn’t matter, but the reality is that in our world, color DOES matter. For a white educator to tell her students of color that race is meaningless is to delegitimize their very real experience of the world, one in which racism continues to be a real and potent force. Whites who want to promote anti-racism need to first acknowledge the reality of white privilege, and not fall prey to the concept of “colorblindness” — which is at best meaningless and at worst offensive and degrading.

    Of course what’s on the inside counts, but we should also be proud of whatever is on the outside, and not deny our differences or pretend they don’t exist. It is the job of educators to convey that to their students of all backgrounds.

  26. BSK wrote:

    Kate-

    Spot on. As an educator of young children (5-year-olds), I tell my children that it shouldn’t matter what a person looks like, but that some people think it does and make unfair rules or ideas as a result. I say that luckily many people have and continue to fight these unfair ideas (connecting it to MLK, other civil rights leaders, and non-PoC allies, so as not to imply it’s a white vs blacks thing), and that if we all keep doing so, maybe we can make MLK’s dream come true.

    Diluting the kids serves nothing except the teacher’s guilt or ignorance. Presenting the truth but instilling faith (so as not to promote despair) is the way to go. Tim Wise points to some great evidence about how this has impacted the psyche of black youth and how it is far more positive for their development of identity than the whole color blind notion.

  27. BSK wrote:

    To the larger post, I can’t believe that people would presume an ethnicity/race/background on someone when there is concrete evidence to the contrary. Now, absent this, naturally people are going to speculate. It’s human nature. When I see someone, my mind naturally goes to work trying to ascertain what their gender is, what their race is, what their ethnicity is, etc. This is not a bad thing in and of itself; humans are actually hard wired to do it. Obviously, what one does with this speculative conclusion is another matter. If I look at someone and think they are non-latino black, and they tell me they self-identify as latino but not black, well, as far as I’m concerned, that person is latino. Who is it for me to say otherwise??? The only times I will even postulate is given some concrete evidence, such as a last name generally particular to a certain country or region, or other evidence that can be considered viable beyond, “Well, you LOOK…”

    For instance, I met a girl at a party not long ago who, based solely on phenotype, most people would be presume to be white. When I talked to her, I realized she had a fairly common Latino name, spoke with a slight Spanish accent, was born and raised in Miami, and that her parents had immigrated here. I asked if she was Cuban (asked, I DID NOT insist), because in my understanding it seemed like the most common scenario based on the information she provided and because I was willing to see past the fact that she didn’t immediately “look” Cuban to me. She was actually relieved when I said that, because she said most people assume she is Puerto Rican, since that is generally the most common area of descent for Latinos in our area of the country. She said she even had people not believe her, which I found appalling, since they had never met a Cuban in our area before and because she didn’t “look” Cuban (which I can only imagine meant she didn’t look like Fidel or El Duque, who look absolutely nothing like each other).

  28. Marcus wrote:

    So I have figured out that whenever someone is trying to figure out my ethnicity, it is for one of two reasons: either they are trying to establish some kind of cultural kinship with me based on a perceived common heritage (the “are you_____?” question) OR they are simply trying to figure out what “box” to put me in (the “what are you?” question).

    The former I don’t mind at all. I am mixed (Dominican, Samoan, and African-American) and I do have an ambiguous look to me. Also, the people asking THIS question are usually “cultural cousins” of mine at least (e.g. the person asking me if I’m Samoan, Tongan, Tahitian or Hawaiian is usually someone who is Samoan, Tongan, Tahitian, or Hawaiian).

    That OTHER question, however, never fails to piss me off because, unlike the first question, this one never comes from a good or well-meaning place.

  29. thesciencegirl wrote:

    Ugh, I get this crap so much. I’m of black (slavery mutt) and Italian-American descent, and a lot of the most racially icky comments I get are in the context of come-ons. Here’s a PSA guys: if you start the conversation with “What you mixed with?” or “Are you [insert random ethnicity]?”, I will definitely never go out with you.

  30. Mickey wrote:

    “The Million Dollar Mulitracial Question” is something I am all too familiar with. I won’t even get into specifics (too many long stories). But I do remember someone here at Racialicious that suggested that whenever someone questions your racial or ethnic identity/background, you should ask, “Why do you want to know?”. That way, it puts the ball in their court and they have to answer to you why they feel the need to question you. But the two main reasons why are what Marcus said. Another reason is just pure curiosity. It is human nature to be curious as well.

  31. Alexis wrote:

    I’ve been asked my race /ethnicity hundreds of times and this post made me think about whether I’d rather someone just assume what it is or ask me about it. Case in point, my doctor thought I was a dark skinned italian and just brought it up in conversation one day like “well you have that dark italian skin” or something to which I was offended that he couldn’t concieve of a way in which i could be a lighter skinned black person and not a darker skinned white person but I maybe I would have been offended if he had asked too because “what does it matter?”. The point is, whether he asked or not, he still formed an idea of who I was based on my appearance so maybe it would have been better if he’d asked before he came up with some inaccurate back story for me. I think the line is drawn between trying to get to know me better or just “making conversation”. My ethnicity shouldn’t be a conversation starter for strangers, in particular men interested in offering back-handed racist compliments but if someone is trying to get to know me and learn more about my background, I’d rather they ask then just run with their assumption.

  32. Charles J wrote:

    Thank you Wendi.

    As a darker, African American man. Thank you 1st for acknowledging your privilege around lighter skin tone and 2nd thanks for acknowledging that cultures that “celebrate” mixed-raceness still have a hierarchy in their own skin tone.

    As a Black person who speaks proper English. I have gotten the question since childhood the comment “you talk white”! I always asked the question so “What is talking Black?”

    Being in the mid-Atlantic in Baltimore, MD where over 60% of the city is Black I never got asked questions about my Blackness (or being mixed with anything) due to my dark skin tone, but when I moved to Boston. I was floored when someone asked me was I all Black?! Because Boston is such a racially diverse city I was often asked not about my skin tone (Blackness), but my ethnic background as people could not believe I was just plain ole’ African-American and not from an island or a country in Africa.

  33. justme wrote:

    I think the reason why people try to find out ‘what you are’ or inquire about someone’s ethnicity if they seem ambiguous is to define their comfort level. Basically the person is trying to make sure they don’t cross a line or know where you stand before revealing their true self. Okay, say some idiot was about to make a black joke, they’d probably be curious about one’s identity to make sure they don’t make a racist or inappropriate joke in front of the wrong person. Basically trying to cover their ass. I don’t know if this makes sense as I not feeling very eloquent today.

  34. GENQ10 wrote:

    I know that we “racially ambiguous” people complain about the ignorance we hear frequently, in reference to our our appearance…and I acknowledge that this ignorance is ignorance, but I would like to reiterate what Wendi said in her post: when mainstream society cannot pin down your race, that is a privilege. “Light/lighter-skinned” privilege is a privilege. I am not white, and I cannot pass but I consider myself lucky that I was not born darker. Not that dark is not beautiful or wonderful, but I see how my darker-skinned relatives’ experience in society has radically differed from mine, and I am grateful that I have slightly more mobility in social (and potentially socioeconomic) situations. My point is, I know many people who would read the conversation on this message board as self-indulgent. Actually, I think some of the comments on this board are somewhat self-indulgent. And that’s not to say that we shouldnt have this conversation…it’s always annoying when people don’t accept you because you dont look the way they think you should look, but let’s not forget that if people say “you’re pretty” because of white-looking features, or “you’re so well-spoken” because you speak “like a white person” that’s still white privilege at work. And in some way, I feel like I am coopting that white privilege when someone accepts me on those grounds. It’s unfortunate, and I disagree with it, but I am still grateful for these privileges.

    that’s all.

  35. Wendi Muse wrote:

    definitely, charles. it’s insulting to assume that blackness somehow renders one incapable from behaving in a certain way, but then equally insulting is that the appropriate behavior conforms with white standards…sigh

  36. urbia wrote:

    I ran across the following quote on a friend’s blog and it reminded me of this thread.

    “It is an established maxim and moral that he who makes an assertion without knowing whether it is true or false is guilty of falsehood, and the accidental truth of the assertion does not justify or excuse him.” — Abraham Lincoln

    When you stereotype someone, and then proceed to spread that stereotype to others, it is a form of lying and should be recognized as such. Even if the person you stereotype fits the stereotype accidentally, partially or even fully, the person that stereotypes is still guilty of falsehood.

  37. Tonya Alexander wrote:

    Great, great writing Wendi.

    The most telling thing you referenced is from your own experiences, when people don’t believe you because it really is just thinly veiled antagonism to place their own s*it on someone else.

    My personal take , which is not very popular, is that it is ALWAYS rude to bring up race (especially at a party!) before you know someone well enough to know their first and last name, be able to call them on the phone AND view them as a friend not just a casual acquaintance.
    Race is personal, I don’t walk up and ask someone right off the bat what their bra or penis size is nor what they weigh if they are an immigrant or what age they are.

    When I get asked I immediately say “you’re not going to like the answer” (if they are non-white) or “why aren’t you asking anyone else here” (if they are white) tell them the answer and then tell them the conversation is over and that I’m done with them. I’m hard school!

  38. Elizabeth wrote:

    Best/worst pick-up line I’ve EVER had used on me: “hey girl, watchu [sic] mixed wit [sic]?” What was truly baffling about this rudeness was that my suitor seemed to be of vague racial background himself – shouldn’t he know better? I’m of mixed European/Latin ancestry (and when I say “European” I mean I have ancestors from 8 of the 50 countries in Europe – so there’s ethnic diversity before racial diversity ever entered the mix). I try to be understanding of peoples’ curiosity when it’s politely expressed, and I stopped getting annoyed with people for, for example: assuming I was half-Asian when I realized Asian friends had made the same mistake. I guess our poor human brains are hard-wired to attempt to categorize: it’s a short-hand for the incredibly complex world we inhabit, a survival instinct. That being said, however, whenever someone asks me “where are you from?” I ALWAYS answer, in as oblivious a tone as I can muster: “Wisconsin.”

  39. B. Durbin wrote:

    ‘ I ALWAYS answer, in as oblivious a tone as I can muster: “Wisconsin.” ‘

    That’s beautiful.