Comments

1. Persia wrote:

   I, for one, will buy a ticket to this just on principle. The fact Rain is hot won’t hurt, of course.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 8:40 am ¶

2. Deaf Indian Muslim Anarchist wrote:

   I love martial arts movies and Rain is hot as hell. I’m stoked for it.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 9:56 am ¶

3. BSK wrote:

   I’m guessing the CGI weapons flying at the screen possibly has to do with the movie being released in 3D?

   One question I have: are you at all bothered by the “magic” often associated with Ninjas and with the martial arts in general. At least a couple scenes in there showed guys doing things that are physically impossible. I know enough about martial arts to know they don’t ACTUALLY give you the ability to fly. But I don’t know enough about their media representations to know if this is a specific film style (like Crouching Tiger), or more Western exotification of a foreign art. We never see boxers jumping over buildings or suspending themselves in air for absurd amounts of time/spin-kicks. Yet, it seems like movies constantly push this “magical Ninja” meme, which seems attached to the general mystical Asian stereotype. I don’t want to project though, especially given my admitted limited knowledge on popular representations within Asian cultures/media. Thoughts?

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 10:24 am ¶

4. atlasien wrote:

   This movie looks very watchable. But if it has the same horrible butt rock soundtrack as the trailer, it will be unlistenable.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 10:29 am ¶

5. atlasien wrote:

   @BSK: Martial artists who can fly are more the equivalent of:

   - Medieval knights who could leap off horses while wearing full plate armor and swinging giant two-handed swords above their heads
   - Soldiers in Vietnam and WWII movies who sling fallen comrades over one shoulder and run a mile while firing a machine gun
   - people getting bashed on the head without any other effect than being unconscious for a few minutes, not, say, falling into a coma and dying of a subdural hematoma
   - a ton of other examples of people doing things that aren’t possible in real life because real life is too boring for action movies.

   I suppose there are a few credulous people out there that believe ninjas really have magic powers. And a larger group of people who halfway believe it… I did a Google search for “ninja training camp” and the results are kind of mind-boggling.

   Asian-Americans hate questions like “do you know karate” and yes, the mystical Asian stuff is irritating. But it’s also complicated, because depictions of martial arts can be very cool and empowering. If you have a choice between being stereotyped as a mystical martial artists versus, say, a rickshaw driver or nail technician, mystical martial artists is not as easy to reject. Asian-Americans are also stereotyped as physically weak, so pride in a martial arts heritage sort of works to compensate for that.

   I don’t think this movie is going to do much to improve images of Asians, but I doubt it will make things worse, either.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 11:03 am ¶

6. Miles Ellison wrote:

   At least the lead role isn’t being played by some white teen idol. I suppose that’s progress.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 11:23 am ¶

7. dejamorgana wrote:

   I don’t know about this movie specifically, but the flying and other superhuman martial arts abilities that you see in a lot of movies lately aren’t actually Western inventions – they come from the wuxia genre of movies and books. Wuxia is a rough equivalent of fantasy fiction in the US – generally based in the past but not necessarily historically accurate, usually has romantic and chivalric themes, and superhuman martial arts abilities are a key element of the genre. This was going on long before Americans started to take an interest in Asian cinema.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 12:47 pm ¶

8. Sarah wrote:

   Have you seen Rain in Park Chan-wook’s I’m a Cyborg but That’s OK? I really like him in that. It’s a non-action role. He yodels in it.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 12:51 pm ¶

9. Persia wrote:

   atlasien, trailer music is almost never what’s in the actual movie. Trailers go through a really interesting process, I watched a great piece about them on TV ages ago.

   Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 12:58 pm ¶

10. dejamorgana wrote:

    I do find it interesting that it’s totally okay for us to see an Asian man (who isn’t a superstar in the US) starring in a US-made Asian fantasy, but the Prince of Persia had to be a white guy. The more I think about PoP’s whitewashing, the madder I get.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 1:03 pm ¶

11. BSK wrote:

    deja and atlasien-

    Thanks for the info. Like I said, I wasn’t sure if I was projecting or not. I didn’t think of it compared to other parallel fantasy elements in action movies, but that’s a really apt analogy. I just fear that, as atlasien pointed out, in the minds of some Westerners, ninja/people who study martial arts/Asians really CAN do that stuff. But it’s interesting to hear that, for the most part, those visuals are part of a specific art/film form, and not just an exoticized version of Asians. Thanks.

    In general, many Americans attach all kinds of values and meanings to the martial arts, some legitimate, some slightly tweaked but otherwise based on legitimate ideas, and some just whacky. As someone who does not know all that much about it myself, it’s sometimes hard to figure out just which is which, and at what point an American practitioner of the martial arts is a legitimate student of them or some hyper kid who wants to learn to fly, read minds, and kill people with his calmness.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 1:20 pm ¶

12. Bagelsan wrote:

    at what point an American practitioner of the martial arts is a legitimate student of them or some hyper kid who wants to learn to fly, read minds, and kill people with his calmness.

    Oh god. I did a little bit of Tae Kwon Do (sp?) as a kid and there was this blond guy there who would make freaking anime sound effects when he practiced kicks and stuff. For our first belt test he showed up with his hair gelled into really extreme spikes Dragonball Z style. (So, wherever that “point” is, clearly he was past it. :p)

    (Oh, and do you mean a white American practitioner, or any American practitioner?)

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 1:34 pm ¶

13. Ray wrote:

    I was surprised that the trailer segues from what looks like a traditional Japanese society to today’s modern one. It kinda just seems so ridiculous to me that there would be traditional Japanese ninja-training villages that prepare assassins for commercial use in the underground.

    I’m don’t know much about Japan, so maybe there are. Or maybe it’s just a part of the Asian Fantasy that dejamorgana mentioned.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 1:38 pm ¶

14. Daryle Lockhart wrote:

    The studio sent out a nice HD trailer, not sure what happened here.

    Quietly, this may be the best things the Wachowskis have been involved with since “Matrix”. The story goes that they watched him get down in “Speed Racer” and developed a story for him to do his thing in.

    A return to this kind of filmmaking will be welcome, at least by me. If it’s successful, it will be a nice change.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 1:56 pm ¶

15. johnjihoonchang wrote:

    @10 dejamorgana:

    It’s a rather funny case w/ NINJA ASSASSIN. After all, if you cast an Asian man, then you’re right back with the Asian person as mystical martial artist stereotype. (I will admit that this stereotype did help me ward off bullies in high school.)

    And then, if you cast the likely Hollywood alternative, you have: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

    But, I think I do prefer this to THE LAST AIRBENDER scenario.

    Yet, with a generic title and a production company with a less-than-stellar track record, I think I’m going to have to pass on this, Rain or no Rain.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 1:57 pm ¶

16. BSK wrote:

    Bagelsan-

    I suppose I was meaning to reference white American, and wrongly just used the term American. Though, I think my larger point speaks to people who’s only connection with Asian culture is their martial arts training. This can certainly be true of Asian-Americans, I’m sure.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 2:24 pm ¶

17. dejamorgana wrote:

    johnjihoonchang, that Mighty Whitey page is hilarious. Shows that a lot of people are paying attention.

    I do have to shout out to Big Trouble In Little China, which subverts a LOT of fantasy tropes. The hero there totally thinks he’s Mighty Whitey in a straight Western kung-fu fantasy, and has his mighty white ass handed to him by just about everyone he meets, including his Funny Asian Sidekick.

    (Of course, it totally bombed.)

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 2:36 pm ¶

18. B wrote:

    Yeah I always question the “mystical Asian” roles. It seems like a venue too ripe for stereotypes to emerge and be legitimized on screen. However I am glad to see an Asian actor in what looks to be a blockbuster movie event. Despite Airbender it may signal that Hollywood is tentatively trying to bring more minority actors on screen. I would support it for that reason and because it looks like a good action film. Maybe with dollars coming in executives will realize having minority actors in lead roles can be profitable.

    But it’s a difficult situation; I’m torn. Do you support a stereotype even if it means you are being represented or supporting a minority actor, director, writer etc? Or do you boycott an event and face invisibility because minorities are not seen as unmarketable/unprofitable?

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 3:55 pm ¶

19. Summer wrote:

    I’ve been kinda on the fence about Rain’s hollywood roles, especially this one. While I’ll surely see this one to at least hopefully see him shirtless

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 5:01 pm ¶

20. Fiqah wrote:

    I’m actually kinda looking forward to seeing this. (Rain is hot. Judge me not.)

    @johnjihoonchang: That page is great.I do have to note here that there’s an ad for what appears to be an interracial dating service, Afro-Romance.com (”Where love is more than skin-deep…”), at the very top of the page. It features a shirtless White man looking down at a smiling Black woman.

    First lines of the article: “Anything you can do, he can do better. He can do anything better than you.”

    Mmm-hm. Internet irony at its best.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 5:45 pm ¶

21. Lxy wrote:

    So people’s opinions of this upcoming movie can be summed up thusly: shirtless Rain=HAWT.

    Posted 31 Jul 2009 at 8:41 pm ¶

22. BSK wrote:

    B-

    I remember reading an interview with Kal Penn and John Cho right after Harold and Kumar came out. They were asked about playing roles that were both somewhat stereotypical and also somewhat ridiculous. They made a point that they conceded to some extent both points were true (though not to the extent that the interviewer implied them to be), but stated that simply getting actors who looked like them onto the screen was the most important thing. Not sure that everyone agrees with that tact, but it was an interesting perspective from two guys within the industry who surely had to battle with being typecast.

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 12:07 am ¶

23. billy wrote:

    I really liked your piece, and all of the awesome comments. As an Asian-American, watching tv shows/films that illustrated a super-human quality to being “Asian”…was kindof cool (yet confusing at the same time).

    Show’s and movies like these gave me confidence that one day I could take out 30 people…if I summoned the magical powers I obviously had…eventually I think when I was 8, I tried for a month to do a Hadoken. After my obvious failure, I deducted that I must have been too young.

    I thought that the masculinity of these Japanese-Samurai, or Ninjas, Chinese-Kung-fu Masters, (Slap another “mystical ‘asian’ character” here) revealed similar damaging and narrow triats about how I was supposed to perform as a Asian-Man. I had to be strong, violent (and really good at it), and have very little dialogue about my emotional state.

    It was a peculiar point in my life when I realized that neither magical powers, or my masculinity were working for me how I thought they were “supposed” to. At least I know now that the later is the one I needed to work on. I mean, magic does exist

    …hum…thanks for the space to rant

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 2:22 am ¶

24. Aiyo wrote:

    I with you Lxy Rain is fine and Namoie Harris is in it too say yay

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 5:57 am ¶

25. RCHOUDH wrote:

    True story:

    Once a McDonald’s commercial came on with these two little Asian kids on it (a boy and girl). The boy was chasing the girl for her burger and they were flying and gliding alot like how it was done on Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon. My daughter, who was six at the time, piped up and asked me if Chinese people can really fly!

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 11:14 am ¶

26. johnjihoonchang wrote:

    @Fiqah: GoogleAds often leads to some rather unfortunate juxtapositions. I notice a *lot* of interracial dating ads appearing on various sites where race is mentioned. And because I don’t hesitate to cover Asian/Asian American issues, a lot of “meet single Asians” ads appear on my blog.

    @B & BSK: It’s a tough situation, supporting PoC lead roles and I’m somewhat torn about it too. If you’re looking at it practically, if films starring PoC leads do well, it helps defy the common Hollywood assumption that “white people won’t watch stuff with PoC leads”. So, in a practical sense, supporting these movies with your dollar will, essentially help the cause of casting directors/producers who are trying to cast PoC lead or might help support a meddling executive to throw a PoC lead into a film.

    On the other hand, genre films tend to be thought of as just that, and so it might not have any larger effect on the overall state of casting when you support a film where there’s *supposed* to be a PoC lead, like NINJA ASSASSIN, because, ultimately, execs/producers will think it’s just a niche market and people get away with all sorts of stuff in niche markets.

    And then, on the foot, any exposure of PoC in multi-dimensional lead roles can have the benefit of causing viewers to see those PoC as three-dimensional and likely helps in the war of attrition against stereotyping/racism because viewers will contrast that specific PoC against themselves and see, “hey, they’re just like me!” It helps to be the protagonist of the story, because then, as a viewer, they are your surrogate in the movie and you step around in the movie world in their (hot, shirtless) body.

    And then again, on the other foot, if it is a movie character in a stereotyped role (in this case, mystic martial arts master) it may do nothing but reinforce the stereotypes already present in viewers’ minds, despite being multidimensional. People seem to have a strong tendency to see what they want to see and to see that which reinforces their current worldview, thus might consequently ignore the dozens of non-mystical martial artist Asians in a movie where there’s a mystical martial artist Asian protagonist.

    So, it’s a win-lose situation either way. Personally, my time is valuable and I’d rather just watch movies that I think I’ll like, although I will avoid movies that suffer from an obvious Race Lift (Prince of Persia, The Last Airbender, etc.) to discourage that practice. And I never choose to not watch a movie because its protagonists are PoC.

    Should a movie out there feature a PoC in a largely non-stereotypical role/genre, I suppose I will also take the time to go see it, to support the first two point above.

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 1:23 pm ¶

27. distance88 wrote:

    @B–

    The question you ask has been debated for a long time: is any representation better than no representation?

    I’d have to say yes, you gotta start somewhere..

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 3:21 pm ¶

28. dejamorgana wrote:

    It certainly is one of those situations where you have to choose the lesser of two evils, and it doesn’t help that the people getting rich from these movies are almost always white producers.

    I tend to land on the side that says positive representation is usually good, even if the roles are stereotypical. Sayid from Lost is a good example of this. I would have been much happier if the show’s only role for an Arab didn’t involve him being a soldier in Iraq’s Republican Guard and a reluctant participant in a terrorist plot. It’s just such a stereotype. I cringed when they introduced him as ex-Republican Guard, cringed again when they played the obvious “accuse the Arab of being the bad guy” card, and double cringed when he had the flashback episode about getting involved in a terrorist action. But the fact that he is even there on the side of the angels is infinitely preferable to the way Middle Eastern people are shown just about everywhere else in American media, which is either A: as villains, or B: not at all.

    There’s also a story that Nichelle Nichols used to tell about being Uhura. Supposedly she had all but made up her mind to leave Star Trek because of tension on the set around her, when she happened to meet Martin Luther King, and he told her what a great role model she was for black kids who had NEVER seen a black person in a “hero role” on TV. Whoopi Goldberg has a similar recollection of seeing Uhura for the first time, which she says was the moment she decided to go into acting.

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 3:51 pm ¶

29. Carmen Van Kerckhove wrote:

    Oh sweet, Sung Kang is in it. That’s enough reason for me to watch.

    SCHWING!

    Posted 01 Aug 2009 at 4:21 pm ¶

30. BSK wrote:

    johnji and deja-

    Perhaps this is a somewhat disjointed point, but there is also the flipside to consider. Oftentimes, when PoCs are cast in non-stereotypical roles, there are calls of them “selling out” or otherwise being non-representational. Obviously, this is the result of the same stereotypes that we would like to see broken down in the media, but nonetheless, this phenomenon exists. There seems to be a catch-22: represent a PoC in a stereotypical way and you are stereotyping; represent a PoC in a non-stereotypical way, and the character isn’t PoC-enough. Thoughts?

    (Please note, these aren’t my thoughts, but common reactions I have observed in the given situations.)

    Posted 02 Aug 2009 at 12:12 am ¶

31. Cycads wrote:

    I won’t be watching this film any time soon principally because it looks nasty. All that flying ninja stars darting at the viewer and potential victims, the sound of them swishing and cutting flesh – all dramatically amplified, are all too much for me (I’m a big softie you see).

    Call me judgmental here, but why is it OK for Racialicious commentors to go on about how hot Rain is? Is it really OK to drool over good-looking PoCs on Racialicious but not good-looking White actors/actresses?

    It’s likely that Rain won’t be cast in roles with plenty of dialogue and that, as Angry Asian Man has said, will pidgeonhole him as an actor known simply for his physical skills and attributes.

    Mod Note – You must have missed this post. – LDP

    Posted 02 Aug 2009 at 4:51 am ¶

32. ocd wrote:

    I hate rain, bi. Playing in this movie gives me more reason to hate him =D

    Posted 02 Aug 2009 at 7:16 pm ¶

33. Pickly wrote:

    Somewhat off topic:

    To people commenting on the johnjihoonchang TV tropes link who haven’t been to the site before, the rest of the site is a pretty fun site in general (at least my opinion), so I’d recommend checking it out just for the heck of it. (though it is best to just ignore the google ads, for reasons described in the #26 johnjihoonchang post.)

    Posted 02 Aug 2009 at 7:24 pm ¶

34. johnjihoonchang wrote:

    BSK:

    I think that discussion runs right out of casting and into the way PoC deal with their communities as well. Over my life, I’ve been subject to being called a “banana” and “white-washed” as a result of my interests and behavior which doesn’t, apparently, conform to what it means for certain Asian Americans to be Asian American.

    I find that non-stereotypical casting can be more of a flashpoint for such discussions, but as long as PoC buy the stereotypes they have for themselves and are determined to police themselves, we’ll never see the end of discussions phrases like “race-traitor”, “oreo”, “banana”, and “white-washed” when we see one of ourselves on the silver screen.

    Personally, within any given PoC community, you’re going to find a such a wide diversity of personalities, interests and beliefs that as soon as you say someone’s not acting [insert PoC type here] enough, you’re picking up an ignorance badge.

    So, I say, ignore the little haters and throw up PoC people in all sorts of different roles. If white folk can play any part, the rest of us should get a chance to play every part too. I think with regular exposure of PoC playing characters that aren’t stereotypical, we’ll find that PoC minds will eventually start changing about what is stereotypical or not as well.

    Posted 02 Aug 2009 at 10:31 pm ¶

35. deb wrote:

    Go, Rain, go, Rain
    It’s raining….

    Thanks for the link johnjihoonchang! Very bookmark worthy.

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 11:40 am ¶

36. Reiter wrote:

    Wow, who would have thought a movie about ninjas who are assassins would provoke such deep discussion. It’s a double-edged sword to see Asians in these types of roles/movies. It definitely reinforces some stereotypes (all Asians know kung fu, but better than some alternatives like Triad gangsters or exotic dragonlady geishas). But for every Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon that’s out there you get dreck like Balls of Fury.

    I haven’t seen Big Trouble in Little China in a while but I do remember that movie fondly as a kid (where the white guy was the comedy relief and the Asian guy was the action hero, ha). And I do remember that one scene from Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story where Jason Scott Lee as Bruce/Kato beat up everyone on the set while the white actor as Green Hornet could only look on in confusion (too bad Stephen Chow backed out as both director and of the role of Kato in the Green Hornet movie).

    And John Cho as Sulu in the latest Star Trek movie. I liked how they subverted the martial arts stereotype somewhat when they mention his character being a master fencer but when he brought out his “Japanese-style” sword in the space jump scene, it brought back memories of chop-socky films rather than the classic European fencing scene that George Takei made so famous.

    But on the flip side to all this, I’ve noticed another trend in movies lately of always showcasing the Asian guy as this effeminate twerp (usually gay; I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with this in and of itself but in the context of portraying said Asian guy as “less-than-manly” so let’s laugh at him instead of with him), case in point, The Hangover.

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 1:17 pm ¶

37. DivergentDana wrote:

    Cycads, as the Mod said, you’ve got the wrong site… we’re equal opportunity oglers here.

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 1:39 pm ¶

38. JC wrote:

    @Cycads: sounds like you’re one of those people who can’t find Asian men hot. Oh well.

    As an AA, I am just glad to see an Asian Man in leading role. No matter how shitty of stereotypical the role is. We are in such a craphole that we’ll take what we can get. As long has he’s not an asexual, kung-fu dimwit ala Jackie Chan’s Hollywood image, then I’m all for it. If the leading men’s Asian and gets laid, then I’m all for it.

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 3:13 pm ¶

39. BSK wrote:

    johnji-

    Fantastic point. I think it’s important that we recognize and acknowledge real life individuals who “defy stereotypes” (not sure why, but that phrase feels awkward to say so I put it in quotes). This should help both members of the community and non-members alike to recognize the diversity that exists within these groups. It’s important, as you acknowledge, that this work comes from within these communities.

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 4:57 pm ¶

40. skk wrote:

    i saw Rain’s Korean dramas/movies and I was surprised by what a great actor he is. he’s won best actor awards in Korea and Korea has some great actors that are admired all over Asia. Rain, he can play the silent type, the witty type, be sarcastic, serious, hilarious…his acting range is versatile and he has tremendous magnetism on the screen. I was startled to see how attractive he was on screen and his smile is contagious! His English is getting better and when it gets better, I can actually see him playing movies in which he is a hero, a romantic lead. He was great in the love scenes too. he is very sensual on screen. Asian men have too long been denied their sexuality on screen. When you watch Korean dramas, you realize how sexy and dynamic the Korean actors are, especially Rain. What a great talent he is. I don’t care for bloody Ninja films, but you can imagine how many women/girls will be going to the movies, just to see and support him. Rain’s fan base in U.S. is huge and soon, non-Asians will realize what we realize — that Rain rains of charisma, talent, and sexuality. Rain is coming!!!

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 7:22 pm ¶

41. Lxy wrote:

    Call me judgmental here, but why is it OK for Racialicious commentors to go on about how hot Rain is? Is it really OK to drool over good-looking PoCs on Racialicious but not good-looking White actors/actresses?

    Yeah, it’s not like we live in a world where White “beauty” standards are constantly propagandized in the media or Hollywood whitewashes movies like Prince of Persia or Avatar.

    Shame on you Racialicious commentors for not “drooling” over White people enough!

    Racialicious needs to have more Jessica Simpson and Brad Pitt posts ASAP.

    Posted 03 Aug 2009 at 10:43 pm ¶

42. Cycads wrote:

    @JC

    Erm, when I did ever say that I don’t find Asian people hot? That’s really not the point I was bringing up. I was only being critical about why people are falling over themselves about Rain’s good looks when it’s obvious this film wasn’t meant to showcase his acting abilities. He ends up simply being a body that women/men drool over. (I recommend finishing reading this before commenting).

    And lxy, perhaps you misunderstand me:

    “Yeah, it’s not like we live in a world where White “beauty” standards are constantly propagandized in the media or Hollywood whitewashes movies like Prince of Persia or Avatar.

    Shame on you Racialicious commentors for not “drooling” over White people enough!

    Racialicious needs to have more Jessica Simpson and Brad Pitt posts ASAP.”

    Again, I’ve said nothing about people here should “drool” over White people more. That’s twisting my words. The moderator was kind enough to remind me of The Race (TM)-approved White guys. That’s a great post. But almost every man (except Vanilla Ice, IMO) on that list has some real credentials to be sexy, attractive, droolicious, if you like, and that mainly boils down to talent and influence.

    Which leads me to thank skk on her comment about Rain’s acting talents. When I commented, I wasn’t sure about who Rain was other than him being hot etc. So maybe one day I’ll see something in Rain that’s more than just a pretty face.

    Posted 04 Aug 2009 at 1:56 am ¶

43. Lxy wrote:

    @ Cycads

    Perhaps you should have clarified your point about Rain’s talents in your first post. The original post lends itself to misunderstanding, such as your question: “Is it really OK to drool over good-looking PoCs on Racialicious but not good-looking White actors/actresses?”

    Posted 04 Aug 2009 at 5:47 am ¶

44. Hokayshenao wrote:

    The effects seem very updated. I hope the story is believable. I think Asian folklore can receive a pigeon-hole quite easy.

    Posted 05 Aug 2009 at 10:36 am ¶

45. Jerry wrote:

    I’m looking forward to this! And the buzz from a Comic-Con screening is very positive. I’ve always thought ninjas were cool, but they’re usually villains in films, so they usually get dispatched too quickly to come off as cool.

    That being said, I think it’s depressing that popular culture (and myself) thinks it’s “cool” to be a hyper-violent “good guy.” Sure, I took a Philosophy of Law class, and I know that violence is the ultimate decider and is the basis of all law in every society. But I don’t see why we’re so unashamed and proud of this sad fact. Is it *REALLY* empowering to watch someone of your race/religion/country/gender/whatever… run around killing people? I find it disturbing that we don’t find it all that empowering that people are doctors and scientists, but instead often prefer to watch folks murder others en masse. Plus I wonder if this love of violence inherently makes women seem inferior to men. If violence = good, and women < men at violence, then men = good/strong, women = bad/weak. And anyone who follows politics knows that Presidential candidates often lose elections because they don’t appear “manly” enough in terms of their ability to kick someone’s ass. This is all fairly anti-intellectual and juvenile thinking, I think we can admit.

    Anyway, I think it’s interesting that the love interest is a black woman. It seems like anytime an Asian guy is gonna get a girl in a somewhat mainstream theatrical movie, the girl is always non-Asian. In the Dragon: Bruce Lee film, Bruce (like his real life counterpart, of course) gets a blonde white girl. Then you got Jet Li in Romeo Must Die having a semi-romance with Aaliyah (black). Jackie Chan flirts with a Latina in a Rush Hour film, a white in Tuxedo, and a Native American in that Western comedy movie he did. John Cho flirts it up with a Latina in the first Harold and Kumar.

    I can’t think of a mainstream movie where the Asian guy has an Asian girl. o_O Wasup with that? White couple romances are a dime a dozen, and so are black couple romances. But for us Asian dudes, we always have a non-Asian love interest in big films. I don’t really have an opinion on whether that’s good or bad, I’m just saying there’s a pattern there and I wonder why that pattern exists so strongly.

    Posted 06 Aug 2009 at 2:28 am ¶

46. j chang wrote:

    @45 Jerry:

    I think part of the reason why you don’t see Asian male leads paired with Asian women is in part that studios/producers/casting is trying to go for a two-fer, in terms of box-office draw. Asian leads (especially Asian men) are probably not thought of as much of a draw to begin with, with such a small community to draw from, so match the guy up with an attractive women of a different demographic and then you can pull in some people from that niche demographic as audience as well.

    Or perhaps, since they’re already going for extreme diversity by casting an Asian lead, you can double up and say that you don’t only have one PoC lead, but you get TWO in one movie! And not just two of the same kind either! This might be some of the same reasoning that lead to Captain Planet-like diverse casts where everyone is a token, rather than a meaningful multi-racial setting.

    Or maybe it’s just because Asian male leads in movies are so rare to begin with that the opportunities to show a mono-racial pairing are limited. In fact, the only one I can think of off the top of my head is Flower Drum Song (1961), although you could say Big Trouble in Little China might fit, if you consider Russell’s best friend “lead” enoguh.

    Also, considering the obviously race-conscious nature of the mentioned projects, it’s not a surprise that interracial pairings exist.

    Also consider, if it’s true for Asian male characters, it’s probably just as true for Asian female characters.

    Which… it is!

    Perhaps there is some sort of aversity to showing a pair of Asians in a relationship. But, the practical side of my brain feels like it’s just done to enlarge the audiece (my first point above). Which says something about what people making the movies think about the potential for mainstream audiences to watch films starring Asian/Asian American actors. Or maybe it says something about what audiences feel about it.

    j chang (aka johnjihoonchang)

    Posted 06 Aug 2009 at 2:52 pm ¶

47. deb wrote:

    Mod Note – You must have missed this post. – LDP

    HOW in the WORLD did I miss that post!?

    Posted 06 Aug 2009 at 8:07 pm ¶

48. Jerry wrote:

    @ j chang, I had similar thoughts, but I still wonder why black men can very often have black women love interests in major films (most of which are mostly viewed by white consumers), but Asian guys and girls are never together on screen. All major films are marketed towards whites first and foremost, so I don’t see why whites would be OK with a black couple, but not an Asian couple.

    Then again, I suppose many whites are much more used to seeing blacks as inherently American, while Asians (especially those like Jet Li or Jackie Chan) are “not American enough” or whatever, and thus need to have some “American” love interests, whatever color they may be (excluding yellow).

    Posted 08 Aug 2009 at 12:13 am ¶

49. MissTiff wrote:

    I love Rain! I love Martial Arts films! This is like a “Best of both worlds” dream come true! Okay, maybe not quite as awesome as Pride and Prejudice and Zombies but waaaaaay up there people! I’m really rooting for him to not only succeed in this film but to have a long and VARIED career in Hollywood (Yes I AM an internal optimist).

    And for all the ladies and gentlemen who think Rain is H.O.T…. hold on to your hats – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84Yvkd7jBh4

    YOWZER!

    Posted 10 Aug 2009 at 12:50 am ¶

50. Jax wrote:

    I totally appreciate the honesty of your post…thanks! I will be curious as to what you think when the movie comes out! I think Rain will do it justice…no way he worked his ass off for so many months on something and have himself look bad, plus he is a perfectionist. I hope this will make Rain a household name in the USA, he deserves it ^-^

    Posted 12 Aug 2009 at 2:02 am ¶