Asher Roth and the Politics of Race in Hip Hop

by Latoya Peterson

I am officially a hip hop curmudgeon. After a weekend spent in Houston listening to “Da Stanky Leg” and “the Halle Berry” on local radio, I am officially declaring myself one of those annoying ass old heads who is always waxing about the good old days. Notice here, I’m not talking about the “back when hip-hop was political” nostalgia – oh, no no. Party-hop, politics, whatever – I miss lyrics and lyricism. When a song had multiple verses and a chorus for me to memorize, not just some hollerin’ and foolishness. After listening to my homegirl V-sheezy explain why Lil’ Wayne may very well be the best rapper currently in the game (and she made a compelling case after explaining the current crop of voices on the mainstream airwaves), I retired to the Verve Remixed 4 and decided that I needed to embrace the fact that while I love hip-hop culture, I’m over rap. Just give me the production and let people who can really sing do their thing.

So it kind of goes with out saying that I had negative interest in listening to the latest flash in the pan, Asher Roth. Someone young, white, and privileged, rapping about being young, white, and privileged? Man, I could go watch that Smirnoff Tea Partay ad for that. At least that was intended to be comedy.

But apparently, Asher Roth has been busy.

In addition to inadvertently exposing some of the more interesting racial dynamics in hip-hop, he’s also been running his mouth about a few other things – like what African rappers need to be doing while he’s talking about how much he loves college or how he’s hanging with “Nappy Headed Hoes”. Here are some of the best bits from the Asher-pocalypse:

M. Dot, Model Minority – Asher Roth x Don Imus x Nappy Headed Ho’s

Apparently, Asher Roth was recently on the Rutgers campus and tweeted that he was hanging out with some “Nappy Headed Hoe’s.” He then tried to clean it up and recant by saying that “he was trying to make fun of Don Imus.” He apologized as well.

Recently my post, “Michael Baisden is a Misogynist Pig“, ran on Racialicious. The post is about the fact that Michael Baisden stated on his radio show that a wife “should just lay there and take it”, if her husband want’s to have sex and she doesn’t. One of the commenters, “Nina” who was open, honest and thoughtful in several her comments, said that she felt that Baisden was being hyperbolic. She writes,

    Perhaps because I think of him as being like Chris Rock, someone who exaggerates but often has a bit of wisdom at the core of the shit talking, what I hear is the kind of thing many men say when alone. And there is the risk that he goes to far OR that listeners will take it as gospel and not hear it as hyperbole. I hear it as hyperbole, my brother and friends hear it as hyperbole but that doesnt mean everyone does.

I responded saying,

    Let me ask you this, do you think Don Imus was being Hyperbolic when he called the Rutgers women’s team Nappy Headed Ho’s?

    If he wasn’t being hyperbolic and was being racist, why should Imus not be tolerated but Baisdens comments are hyperbolic?
    Often times, I have found that people hide behind the defense of laughter when in reality it constitutes hate speech.

    Can’t sprinkle sugar on shit and call it ice cream.

Having just wrote these comments on Wednesday, you can imagine my surprise at seeing Asher Roth say the same thing,
on Twitter, on Thursday.

Why should Asher Roth be singled out when Black men call us hoes all the time?

I am not saying that Asher should not be criticized for what he has done but we need to keep it even and acknowledge that many Black rappers and Black men, and for that matter Black women, refer to Black women, reflexively, as “hoes.”

Harry Allen, Media Assassin – Fight the White Rap History Rewrite

[F]rom a certain angle, there’s just a shade of difference between white people rapping and white people telling nigger jokes. (I know that this framework, though immediately clear to a certain number of Black people, if only on a gut level, isn’t obvious to others, and is completely offensive to many white people. I elaborate on it, more, in two other works: (1) “White People and Hip-Hop,” which I recorded with both Racialicious‘ Carmen Van Kerckhove and writer Jason Tanz (Other People’s Property) for Van Kerckhove’s “Addicted to Race” podcast, and (2) “The Unbearable Whiteness of Emceeing: What The Eminence of Eminem Says About Race,” which I wrote for The Source. [As well, I also spoke about this during an episode of Oprah I taped with Michael Eric Dyson, Sister Souljah, Sister 2 Sister's Jamie Brown, and others in the fall of 1997, though Harpo never aired the piece.]) Both behaviors form a set of inadequate, insufficient white responses to the system of white supremacy, formatted, here, as “entertainment,” or “fun.” Of course, any fun, carried out over a long enough period, starts to look like making fun of to the one not in on the fun, as does any insufficient response, carried far enough, in the midst of a dire situation.

In spite of, or maybe because of, the generally unsatisfactory artistic role white rap has often played when considered this way, I’ve gotten far more out of it by studying the social networks around it; i.e., how it makes white people act. (To a great extent, this is what “The Unbearable Whiteness of Emceeing” is about.). Toward this end, a few choice details jump out of the Asher Roth New York Times piece and land in my lap:

1) It never fails to amaze me how much better white people’s jobs are than Black people’s jobs. In the piece, Asher Roth’s father, whose name is David, is described as “the executive director of a design firm.”

It just sticks out. First of all, so many rappers grow up without fathers at all that to hear of an artist with one is unusual. But, here, there is a father, in the home, and he executive directs a design firm.

2) That a rapper is white is often enough to get them major media coverage. One sees this over and over in the coverage of white rappers, from at least the Beastie Boys to the present. Take away Asher Roth’s whiteness, and is there a story here? Even more, is there a career here? Roth’s now famous XXL cover, as one of ten “freshmen” rappers expected to do great work in 2009, is often mentioned, but Wale and Charles Hamilton sure aren’t.

Which reminds me:

3) White rappers frequently appear as though being handed off from one set of white hands to another. Here, narratively, Roth is handed from his parents, first, to his manager, Scooter Braun, who discovered him, to Steve Rifkind, his label owner, to the Times author, Jon Caramanica, to the fans.

And, most of all:

4) History is often rewritten in the interest of prizing white people, of which white rappers are, of course, a subset. In the piece, Caramanica, who, as a former editor at VIBE and a long-time writer covering hip-hop, should know better, says this: “Whether they talk about it or not, plenty of rappers are from the suburbs, but not one has created an aesthetic around it until Mr. Roth.”

Really? What did De La Soul do, then? What did the Dungeon Family do? Heck: What did Public Enemy do? (I wrote about P.E.’s suburban roots and worldview at length for The Village Voice in a 1988 piece, “Strangers in Paradise.”)

Jeremy R. Levine, Social Science Lite – Asher Roth is the Anti -”White Guilt”

Interestingly and quite arrogantly, Roth is harnessing a shtick of white privilege as he claims the authenticity of the…erm…suburbs. You know, because suburban kids can’t relate to hip-hop in its contemporary form. Why? Well, that’s a little unclear. Roth’s basic claim is that white kids in the suburbs have been consuming hip-hop for years, but have never had some one they can relate to, some one to represent them and their voices. You know, because white folks can’t relate to black folks. And, of course, because only white folks live in the suburbs. Comparing Eminem to Roth, the blog No Trivia wrote it better than I could have: “But Eminem’s use of his whiteness came from a desire to prove himself in spite of the unfortunate reputation of white rappers that came before him, not some strange sense of privilege because he’s the person actually buying rap CDs.”

In the most blatant example of white supremacy in hip-hop, Roth is absolutely obsessed with his whiteness. He doesn’t problematize his whiteness, like when Em forced us to re-think what it means to be white in his deeply personal discussions of growing up poor. No, instead Roth wants us to realize that we should like him because, well, he’s white and privileged just like us! His most recent song leak (which you can download here) details the trials and tribulations of being the next great white rapper and the subsequent comparisons to Eminem. Simultaneously, Roth reminds us that while he is no Eminem (he is from privilege and proud of it), he is unabashedly white (and therefore more relatable than those black rappers we thought we liked). Quoted in a recent New York Times piece, Roth explains the difference: “Culturally, Em was almost a black guy. My background is more stereotypically white.” That’s just great, Asher. How astute. It’s one thing to be aware of your racial identity; it’s an entirely different thing to embrace a privileged identity as your claim to superiority in a culture dominated by minority artists.

In an article from 2005, Brother Ali poignantly discussed white fans’ relationship to underground white rappers. “One of the hardest things we’re dealing with now is the underlying feeling of white supremacy among fans who feel they are a part of hip-hop, but are listening to and prefer mostly white MCs,” says Brother Ali. “They believe that Aesop Rock is better than independent artists who are Black and mainstream artists like Ludacris. These MCs are doing a lot with hip-hop artistically that they have learned from Black people, but [their fans] don’t want to hear from the old-school originators because they believe it’s the white MCs who created the styles they like. This isn’t an underground-versus-mainstream thing—it’s a racist thing.” My emphasis.

Brandon Soderberg, No Trivia – Asher Roth is a Problem

It’s never explicitly said—because if it was, he wouldn’t even be afforded the minor fame he has right now—but Roth’s rapping is not an alternative to mainstream hip-hop or capitalistic corpo-rap, but an alternative to blackness. It’s not entirely clear if Roth even realizes this (probably because he’s not thinking as hard as he thinks he is), but his contempt for most rappers mixed with statements about how he’s the kind of guy buying the music—again, and therefore not black people—sound contemptuous.

When I twittered about writing something on Asher Roth, NattheDem came back with a link I had missed. In an interview with the AP, Roth is quoted:

Roth addresses poverty and greed on the song “Sour Patch Kids.” And at his fans’ behest, Roth uploaded to his MySpace page “A Millie Remix,” a freestyle rhyme over Lil Wayne’s “A Milli” beat, criticizing rappers who boast about having millions of dollars but “don’t share, don’t donate to charity.”

“When I dropped that … (I thought) ‘You guys are always going off about how much money you have. Do you realize what’s going on in this world right now?’ All these black rappers — African rappers — talking about how much money they have. ‘Do you realize what’s going on in Africa right now?’” Roth says.

“It’s just like, ‘You guys are disgusting. Talking about billions and billions of dollars you have. And spending it frivolously, when you know, the Motherland is suffering beyond belief right now.’”

Sounds awfully familiar, doesn’t it? A lot of things came to mind when I read that quote, but none of them are printable.

Last month, Marisol LeBron sent me a video of Asher Roth covering D’Angelo’s How Does It Feel:

At the time, I had not heard of Roth, but the video twisted my stomach. Everything that was so right about the video had been perverted into all kinds of wrong.

Now, after doing a bit of reading and seeing how Roth is being championed as someone who is just expressing himself, I understand my reaction a little better.

And simply because it amuses the hell out of me – The Green Tea Partay, Smirnoff’s fake rap beef sequel:

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Trackbacks & Pings

  1. Feministe » Asher Roth is everything that is wrong with the world, take two. on 05 May 2009 at 12:53 pm

    [...] on Fat is a Feminist Issuegruntled atheist on Deep Thought of the DayMaggieK on Disability and ClassAsher Roth and the Politics of Race in Hip Hop at Racialicious – the intersection of race and pop cu… on Asher Roth is everything that is wrong with the worldFashionablyEvil on Fat is a Feminist [...]

  2. Serious Talk About a Guy I Can’t Take Seriously. « Wassup Rockers on 06 May 2009 at 2:06 am

    [...] like Asher Roth’s public persona–who the fuck knows what he’s like in private.  This Racialicious post delves into the several stupid things he’s said.  (Make sure to read the comments, too, [...]

  3. Asher Roth and the Racial Crossroads. « PostBourgie on 08 May 2009 at 11:47 am

    [...] There are some other great blog entries on Asher Roth and white privilege, especially from Jeremy Levine at Social Science Lite, Brandon Soderbergh at No Trivia, and Latoya Peterson at Racialicious. [...]

  4. illdoctrine’s latest: Asher Roth and the Racial Crossroads | M.I.S.S. on 08 May 2009 at 2:01 pm

    [...] running for office and people were declaring him a “terrorist”. Upon the dawning of two Caucasian MCs and their newest album releases, Asher Roth and Eminem, respectively, America is revisiting the [...]

  5. To share Jay Smooth’s thoughts on Racial Crossroads « motivations. on 12 May 2009 at 6:55 am

    [...] Racialicious, the smartest blog on issues of race, on Asher Roth.  I’m going to reserve my comments on him right now.  By the way,  Bread Aisle wasn’t a bad album, but it wasn’t good either. [...]

  6. 7 White Rappers Way Better than Eminem and Asher Roth | Mediahacker on 15 May 2009 at 11:57 pm

    [...] claim space in hip-hop. Creative talent ought to be a requirement too. Unfortunately, people are talking about Eminem and Asher Roth, who arguably don’t have much of either, as if they’re the [...]

  7. Seven Quick Takes – Fresher Edition « Sanabitur Anima Mea on 09 Oct 2009 at 11:44 am

    [...] 6. Most students actually do come to University to learn things (other than where to buy the cheapest vodka.) This is one of many reasons why Asher Roth’s music is annoying and made of fail (though far from the most important reason). I’m not the only one who thinks so. [...]

Comments

  1. SarahNicole wrote:

    I am officially declaring myself one of those annoying ass old heads who is always waxing about the good old days.

    Don’t forget to tell the kids to get off your lawn. :-D

  2. atlasien wrote:

    Say what you will about Da Stanky Leg, but the little kids love it. So it always brings a smile to my face :-)

    This is an interesting post, and I saw the other one about Asher Roth at Feministe, but I have nothing else to add about him. I feel like I want to add something… but he’s enraging and boring in such equal proportions that they cancel each other out, plus I can’t face actually watching one of those videos all the way through.

  3. shani-o wrote:

    Never heard of the guy (which just shows how out of touch I am with both modern music and my RSS reader), but I’m pretty grossed out by some of the stuff he says. Not more or less so than I am by black rappers, but in a different way.

    I think Levine’s post is particularly on point.

  4. Deaf Indian Muslim Anarchist! wrote:

    Asher Roth is a douche-bag. When I saw his name on your Twitter, I had no idea who this guy was, so I googled him and I rolled my eyes. Oh my god. Why the hell should we listen to a privileged, white preppy boy from a nice neighborhood rapping?

    While we’re at it, why don’t we ask a bunch of rich, white, privileged posers from Harvard University to put on a 77-style streetpunk show? Oh yes, I’m sure they know all about the hardships of life.

  5. Seattle Slim wrote:

    Very good post! I like this a lot. I heard “I Love College” and was immediately turned off. I heard one track off a mixtape and my interest was piqued, but once I saw that video something wasn’t clean about that guy for me.

    Now reading this I see WHY I don’t like the guy.

    Now as for his condemnation of rappers’ riches and Africa, he has a point. He could’ve said it better, but it’s the truth.

  6. Latoya Peterson wrote:

    @Slim –

    Naw, he doesn’t have a point.

    Is there a point to be made about rappers riches and reinvesting in places with need? Africa – apparently, we’re back to Africa as a country – is mentioned. But one could also talk about re-investments in the neighborhoods these rappers rep that never seems to happen. And that would be a very good point.

    However, I’m chafing for a number of reasons:

    1. The “othering” of black American artists. Yes, due to the slave trade a lot of us have vague ideas our roots lie in somewhere on the continent. But Roth’s quote positions us as people who have responsibilities (1) far beyond his own responsibility and (2) to Africa, when many of the folks he criticized are born and raised here, and have been here for generations. Blacks aren’t Americans in the eyes of many.

    2. The irony kills. He’s mad about rappers talking about money and not investing on the continent, and this bama is rapping about college and not talking about education reform – or anything else. (It’s also laughable that the stable household, came from money dude is lecturing others on how to give back, but that’s another post). Don’t claim your shit is entertainment and then get up in their shit.

    3. It echoes the sentiment that I will occasionally hear from a certain type of white person (normally a student but not always) who is so busy patting themselves on the back for their global awareness that they overlooked the reason why others may not be advocating along side them. It’s like what I kept repeating when I worked in the environmental biz – it isn’t that minorities don’t care about the Earth, it’s that most of us don’t have the luxury to make something our sole focus.

  7. Kandeezie wrote:

    This guy is not rapping, he’s using rap to make fun of black culture and black people. D’Angelo? Really?

    Black rappers and gold chains – He criticizes blacks for not taking care of Africa with their seemingly newfound wealth (we’re suppose to take the burden off the white man now, because they’ve been holding up Africa for years and it’s time for blacks to take a turn so they can resume their responsibilities of ruling the entire earth).

    Take the power back! – He’s saying to white kids that he’s tired of black people making money off white kids who buy their records – that it’s now time for white people to make money from rap (because they’re apparently not – lol), get credit for what’s rightfully theirs and keep the wealth within their community. He thinks he’s being revolutionary by seeing his white privilege and using that to criticize blacks (so original) while pouting about the imbalance and unfairness of blacks dominating in a field he would like to be in.

    You see, as long as he says so, rap music is everybody’s music created from no where, and as long as his culture owns the history books, he can re-write it any way he pleases.

    Unbelievable.

  8. Seattle Slim wrote:

    @Latoya,

    Ah well then touche. I agree with you. I also read a few of the posts quoted in the article and saw my error as well. In his I Love College song/video he’s materialistic in a completely different way but given the current economic situation, he’s just as wrong as Lil Wayne or anyone for rapping about diamonds/

  9. lakergrrl wrote:

    I thought I Love College was funny at first, a humorous rap narrative with a white upper middle class view. But a whole album of with this kind of foolishness? I work way to close to Georgetown for that stuff to amuse me anymore.

  10. Amused0472 wrote:

    I don’t dare watch that “How Does It Feel” clip for fear that I may throw up. I don’t have time for that nonsense. But isn’t it interesting that there’s so much hype and he’s not even original about his whiteness. This is just about money-how much he can get before the 12-year-old girls who don’t know any better get bored.

  11. WestIndianArchie wrote:

    Asher’s such an easy target though. From the very beginning he’s been a blogger’s dream. All he does is make missteps. On top of that, his music doesn’t appeal to most bloggers. Who blogs for the people who play flip cup and wear flip flops during the winter time? Tucker Max? Dane Cook?

    Just like you can pick on 50 Cent and Rick Ross for their misogynistic machismo. (the whole feud is about how either of them treat the women in their lives. Starting out with Ricky calling out 50) Or go after the Clipse for glamourization of the drug trade.

    You should really be talking about how a virtual unknown was able to get to this level in 6 months.

    As his first weeks #’s show, A. Roth doesn’t have grass roots support. (something like 13K sold, despite much MTV love)

  12. Phil wrote:

    Good points being made here, but the lack of effort in seeing what Hip-Hop STILL has to offer, and the nerve of saying this,

    “Just give me the production and let people who can really sing do their thing. ”

    IS JUST SO TYPICAL. It’s SO easy to dismiss thentire genre instead of giving credit where it’s due to the artists who ARE making the effort at expanding the genre. What you said is completely unfair to artists like Mos Def, Dead Prez, Jay Electronica, the Roots, Joell Ortiz, Blu, Bishop Lamont, and whole host of new and now-veteran artists that DO provide the alternative. But, NO ONE has the courage, the wherewithal, or even the awareness to try and seek and promote these kinds of artists.

    And saying the typical, tired argument “I don’t know that guy” is weak, cheap, and corny in this “Internet age”. All that complaining implies a desire you’re too numb to satisfy, because it’s easy to QUIT. It’s easy to ABANDON. It’s easy to be NEGATIVE, especially when you think the subject you’re dismissing is wholly negative; which completely cancels out such whining because nothing in this world is wholly negative.

    Try and find the good parts, people. You won’t be disappointed.

  13. Amused0472 wrote:

    And who are the “African rappers,” exactly? [I think I could get into some Zulu hip-hop or someone rapping in Swahili.] His use of the phrase apparently to denote well known black artists just highlights his Ignorance. Maybe he should attend and graduate his college classes instead of rapping about it. Now I’m just mad.

  14. Ejunco wrote:

    The guy’s album is garbage, and that video is gross.

  15. Walt Byars wrote:

    Wow, those links are really excellent. They give a very good analysis of why Roth is so disgusting. But I’ve seen a number of people say what Deaf Indian Muslim Anarchist posted, which I think is wrongheaded.

    It is a popular meme, which seems most prevalent among white “backpacker” hip hop fans, that the “real” hip hop is about poverty or race or politics. Not only is this totally ignorant of hip hop history but racist. Its an orientalist assumption that any authentic manifestation of black culture must be about these topics. There are great hip hop records by people from tough backgrounds which don’t contain a word about the “hardships of life” and many more which only mention it peripherally.

    I disagree with the content of the hip hop curmudgeon stance in the original post. Say that you like really wordy rap songs. Or that you like the east coast style. But it is not correct to conflate that style with “lyricism”. Even if a song repeats a few lyrics throughout, if it skillfully makes those lyrics so its good to listen to, then it is good lyricism. People who complain about the current state of hip hop usually can’t see where the problem rises and they blame everyone else. They elevate a style which dominated hip hop for a long time but has become stagnant over the last decade. Do they reconsider the limitations of that style? Do they try to reinvigorate it themselves? Sometimes they do, but all too often it is the fault of southern rap or stupid audiences or record executives. Of course, I’ve no idea of the specific beliefs of Latoya Peterson beyond the single paragraph she wrote on this topic.

    That said, the commercial failure of Asher Roth (compared to what his hype machine aimed for) strikes a good blow at a phenomenom which would have truly been bad for hip hop music. As Cocaine Blunts and Hip Hop said about Roth and Charles Hamilton

    “Since we’ve firmly established that no human being that isn’t attached to a computer monitor knows or cares about Charles Hamilton[2], we can definitely skip the chicken and egg deliberations. Nobody is playing catch up here. The labels have abandoned the traditional model of finding the underground hits and breaking them, the model that has produced almost every significant rap act of the past twenty years. They are suddenly so arrogant to think they can create hip hop stars in a petri dish. “

  16. Thea Lim wrote:

    Aghast! I can’t believe you would mock “Halle Berry.” That is one of Dallas’ proudest exports! I don’t know if I can read this website anymore…

    [yes yes i am joking :) ]

    Thanks for breaking this down so faithfully Latoya. Have not been following it but had the sneaking suspicion I should, so thanks for doing the legwork :)

    I’m a non-black POC who listens to hip hop and R&B because it is basically the only alternative to white narratives in mainstream art and music. Well, for that reason and because I just like the stanky leg.

    But I have often marvelled at how, as problematic as spaces like BET are, they are also one of the few places where I see groups of people that even slightly resemble my community and my narrative.

    The fact that Roth is like “buy me! i’m white! ima stop black ppl from marginalising non-black hip hop fans!” is just, well…I’m prolly thinking a number of things along the same lines as LDP’s unprintables.

    Ugh. Let’s just hope this guy disappears quickfast.

  17. ghettoManga wrote:

    on one of my youTube videos, a white kid comes on and says he and his mom decided black people “beat” our kids because we are “primitive”… then when people jumped on (before i had a chance to reply) and called him and his mom racist, he got lost trying to defend himself…

    asher reminds me of that kid. i really don’t care about people like that. they are examples of why racism isn’t going anywhere in america: too many people just don’t get it.

    i doubt asher INTENDS to be a racist douchebag, he just IS. having said that, the only songs i’ve heard from him have been a mixed bag (for the record, i enjoyed that “milli” remix).

    i don’t think he will last long…

    and Latoya, there is still plenty of quality rapping going on. wack shit is in style, so corporate radio and music teevee will give you. hell, even dope mainstreamers are dumbing it down. but you should do yourself a favor and add “rappersiknow” or my blog “ghettomanga” to your rss feeds or twitter. you’re just looking for rhyme in all the wrong places.
    luv yoo!
    peace,
    samax
    -ghettoManga.com

  18. Clara wrote:

    Latoya, Asher Roth just performed at my school last Friday! What a coincidence…

    I’d never heard of Asher Roth before this, so I was just watching quietly. But lots of people were singing along with him…and guess what race they were? Yup, mostly white people were mouthing his lyrics. He told us that his grandparents went to my school and that two of his cousins currently attend, so I wasn’t surprised.

    During his performance, a bunch of people dressed up in Santa costumes (coat, pants, beards, and everything) and I didn’t understand it at all.

    Everyone went crazy when he sang “I Love College” and honestly, it felt very weird. I go to an Ivy League school, but I’ve always been bothered by the stereotypical privileged kids who go here. His song sort of reminded me why I feel this way.

  19. [dave] wrote:

    dang i’d only heard that predictable-yet-sure-to-catch-on-at-frat-parties track and thought not much of him, but this guy’s a waste of space.

  20. Emily wrote:

    I actually smacked my forehead when I read this – “Em was almost a black guy.” Wha?

    This guy has bought into the racist hierarchy hook, line & sinker. Em isn’t “really white” like him because he’s too poor and comes from a kinda f-ed up family? Because he worked hard to and mostly succeeded at earning the respect of influential black artists/producers/rap fans? He might as well say he’s not really white because he’s a n-lover. (Don’t know if reference to that term is appropriate for this blog, feel free to edit).

    It both stereotypes black people, and reinforces the idea that a person who does not appropriately respect the racial hierarchy of white supremacy is not “really white.” Ick all around.

  21. Tracey wrote:

    “Culturally, Em was almost a black guy.”
    Hummm. I am not sure what to say. There are soooo many things wrong with that statement alone. I wonder what it is that keeps Em from being completely like a black guy? Seriously, seriously? That one sentence just ruined my day. “Cause Em’s experiences are all there is to being a black guy. Yep, I’m fixating.

  22. Thea Lim wrote:

    I just hit play on the Asher Roth does “How Does It Feel” and had to hit stop almost immediately.

    Just out of curiousity LDP what is it that you like about the original video?

    Even though it solely features a man, I’ve always felt like that video and song shows real love for the female sexuality, but obviously specifically black female sexuality. It validates, embraces and celebrates that sexuality in a very poignant way. And also does a lot of subverting of the gender binary.

    It is near impossible to explain why that video is important or meaningful to anyone who really doesn’t understand what it means to have your sexuality entirely coopted by dominant narratives that have nothing to do with your culture of origin.

    That’s one thing that amazes me about cheesy R&B. Maybe I am reading too much into things, or finding what I need in things whether or not they in and of themselves are offering that, but I really feel like so much of R&B offers a celebration and validation of non-white culture and sexuality — and that part of the music is completely invisible to non anti racist white folks.

    It sometimes boggles my mind how people can look at that D’Angelo video and all they see is some shiny guy singing.

  23. more cowbell wrote:

    Nothing to add that hasn’t already been said, just a *clap clap clap* for both the post and your comment #6.

  24. Latoya Peterson wrote:

    @Phil –

    Lawd, you can’t make jokes now days, can you?

    Rapping isn’t singing. That was a joke. And if you look way back into the archives, pull up the Rock the Bells Open thread where quite a few folks noted that Mos Def’s “rapping days” where behind him because he just stands on stage and sings, then does five track snippets from Black on Both Sides and calls it a day.

    Yes, there’s so much more if you look, but you know what – not looking. Why? I’m already up on everyone you mentioned, with the exception of Joell Ortiz, Blu, and Bishop Lamont. You also didn’t mention Skillz, who I’ve been quietly jocking since I saw him at Hip Hop Honors. Go follow Questo’s twitter feed, QTips Twitter feed, Andre 3000s barely updated twitter feed – they’ll say the same shit I am. Yes, there is good stuff. Great stuff. And if you look overseas, you find even more great stuff.

    But where is it?

    Problem is, folks who want to heard good stuff are being outnumbered. Sad yet true. And I’m getting tired of falling for artists who I never hear from again because I’m one of 6,000 people who liked them, which means they can’t make a living in the current market.

    @WestIndianArchie –

    Asher Roth is an easy target for dismissing him based on whackness. But, if you follow the last link in the post, to the Feministe thread, you’ll see why I took the time out to write this post.

    @Amused0472 –

    I was trying to figure out if he lumped K’nan in with that, or maybe Akon, but then I re-read it and realized he was using black and African iterchangeably. When I write more about the global hip hop scene, I’ll try to make sure to include some.

    @Walt Byers –

    I disagree with the content of the hip hop curmudgeon stance in the original post. Say that you like really wordy rap songs. Or that you like the east coast style. But it is not correct to conflate that style with “lyricism”. Even if a song repeats a few lyrics throughout, if it skillfully makes those lyrics so its good to listen to, then it is good lyricism. People who complain about the current state of hip hop usually can’t see where the problem rises and they blame everyone else. They elevate a style which dominated hip hop for a long time but has become stagnant over the last decade. Do they reconsider the limitations of that style? Do they try to reinvigorate it themselves? Sometimes they do, but all too often it is the fault of southern rap or stupid audiences or record executives. Of course, I’ve no idea of the specific beliefs of Latoya Peterson beyond the single paragraph she wrote on this topic.

    That’s refreshing. I really like how you mentioned you have no idea of my specific beliefs beyond this paragraph – it drives me insane when people read one piece and start bellowing about how I never talked about xyz when I did two months ago. Use the search box people, damn.

    At any rate –

    (1) Lyricism, word play, rhymes, sick flow – that’s what I like. I wouldn’t call that east coast style though. And I understand completely what you are saying about people putting the demise of rap into a neat little basket. Though I am sick of the Halle Berry and the Stanky Leg (come on y’all – I heard each of those songs at least six times in three days. I was about to put my eye out) I don’t think Southern rap or reggaeton or stupid audiences or ANY ONE FACTOR is to blame for the current state of hip-hop. Things are complicated and a lot of it is personal growth – of both the audience and the artists. We’re looking for different things now, we’re in different spaces.

    In addition, as I noted above, I don’t subscribe to the idea that hip-hop has to have some redeeming social quality or else it isn’t “real” nor to the fact that someone needs to live in poverty to understand hip-hop.

    And your last bit is quite telling – you can maufacture hype, but will it resonate? Asher Roth inadvertantly exposed some divisions in hip-hop, but the message came back fairly clear – it’s not happening for the kid.

    As to my specific beliefs, I think that rap is stagnant because we are in a period of waiting for the next thing. And I strongly believe that the next thing will come when the US starts looking beyond its borders and seeing what the rest of the world is bringing to hip-hop. But that’s just my take, based on limited observation and a little bit of research.

    @Thea –

    Next time I see you, I’m going to make you do the stanky leg. In the teahouse.

  25. Joseph wrote:

    Every now and then something comes down the pike that smells bad despite its shininess (see, also: Obsessed) and I think to myself, “Oh, I can’t wait to hear what Latoya thinks of this.”

    You did not disappoint me re: Asher Roth.

    For me, Roth’s whiteness is much less bothersome than his social class, but that does not negate any of the race-based arguments you have made (or quoted) here. While Eminem is the obvious comparison to my mind the differences between them crystallize both race AND class arguments against Roth. Simply put Em is a white artist from a humble background who made his black producer rich, not the other way around. And I think that is huge.

    Perhaps the less obvious (but I’d argue more apt) rap-analogue to Roth is Will Smith. Although Smith’s background was more solidly middle-class than Roth’s he practically invented using suburban themes in a hip hop context. And like Roth, he was marketed at the time as a relatable alternative to scary, sexy “black” hip hop.

    Rap music has traveled all over the planet and can be found in cultures that are extremely different from its African American origins… and I don’t think that is a bad thing at all.

    But.

    From Palestine’s “sling-shot hip hop” to French- African immigrant’s idolization of American hip hop culture, the men and women doing the rapping are all marginalized in relationship to a larger culture. That dynamic is what makes it hip hop. (Which, I’d argue is why one graffiti artists started exhibiting in galleries tagging died… it was based on a sometimes playful but essentially subversive relationship to authority). What Roth is doing is inverting this relationship of themes to the dominant culture… It’s comparable to writing Blues songs about being rich and successful. It is distasteful irony at best and racist mockery at worst.

    And that is what makes him so grotesque.

  26. j.ceasless wrote:

    Since it hasn’t been mentioned, D’Angelo never felt comfortable making the original video, and was crushed on tour when people would basically scream “We don’t care about your music! Take off your shirt already!” Since it is one the prime factors for why D’Angelo has not released a new record, it would be an interesting point of discussion in its own right. As it is, knowing that history just makes me dislike Roth all the more (hadn’t heard of this “cover” attempt before).

    @Walt

    Why do you only associate the preference for lyrical complexity with the East coast style? West Coast acts from the same time period are equally cherished by the same group of people you are talking about. There are plenty of great acts around Right Now who deliver complex rhymes that would satisfy most curmudgeons. But they are being checked only by a relatively select few, including the much maligned backpackers. Blaming the industry for (basically) only promoting crappy lyricism seems totally fair to me. Blaming “the South”, less so, but then again, the South is only represented (above ground) by the acts that the industry decides to promote.

  27. AintIAWoman wrote:

    You know, I was watching MTV the other day and hardly paying attention, until a commercial break when I heard this crappy music coming from my TV. I looked up and had no idea who was responsible, until MTV scrolled something about “Asher Roth.” I shrugged it off as some typical unappealing mainstream music act. UNTIL I read this.

    Damn, Latoya, this is a good piece. You know, I agree with what Walt Byars said that its not about rap only being about “hardship” etc, and I also don’t think white people should NEVER under any circumstances participate in hip hop– I think Brother Ali illustrates someone who can be self-aware enough to do this properly and with talent– though clearly he comes from a unique background that made him a lot more anti-racist than others. But Asher Roth represents the most awful outcome when white people rap. I think that quote about “black rappers” and Africa is so incredibly offensive and out of place, I can’t even explain it. As if somehow…black rappers are the most responsible for whats happening in Africa right now? What is your executive director father doing with HIS money? How about a little history lesson? Do you even have ANY idea whats going on in Africa, anyway?

    As if somehow the privilege he was BORN with is totally fine & something to be proud of— but ‘black rappers’ singing about how much money they’ve earned, etc, is unacceptable and ASHER ROTH has to call them out for not helping ‘their people’ in Africa. The whole thing is just disgusting.

    Also his music is just plain old awful.

  28. Matt E. Allen wrote:

    Thank you for introducing me to this idiot. His comment on African-American rappers not giving money to their homeland made me want to slam my head against a wall.

  29. Tracey wrote:

    @ Clara: yeah. I don’t go to an Ivy league school, but agree that “I love College” is really problematic. I absolutely hate that song for the image it portrays. Where are the songs for college students that go to school full time and work 20,30, 40hrs a week? The ones that have to go to school on a semester by semester bases because they have to work full time in between to save up for the next semester even with family help? I see the kind of people singing along to all his lyrics as the same type who have their bills paid by parents and whose idea of being broke is when there parents won’t send them spending cash. I get mental images of the types I could see going crazy for him and it brings back not so great memories.

  30. Walt Byars wrote:

    j. ceasless- in the 90s when people compared West Coast and East Coast rap the latter was considered more lyrical. It also wasn’t uncommon to say certain west coast rappers had an east coast style (I recently read an old review of Ras Kass which said precisely this).

    And I don’t see why complex rhymes are so great. Some people act like this is self evidently true. Would your computer be better if you still had to be a trained programmer to use it? It usually takes more skill for a rapper to pack captivating sounds into simple rhymes than complex ones (and it takes a better ear for the listener). Multies can be awesome, but they are one of the “cheapest” rapping techniques in terms of how much response you get for them compared to the craft it takes to make them. Not that it is less legitimate to prefer this style, but what doesn’t follow this pattern isn’t “crappy.”

    And I don’t think rap is declining at all. If you think the more complex east coast style is the end all be all, and that style has become moribund because of its limitations, that’s the only way in which hip hop is declining.

  31. livininphilly wrote:

    I’m so not impressed with Asher Roth. I cannot stand that “I love college” song b/c it accurately describes most of the people who went to my school.

    Interestingly, I believe that the early hype around him came from endorsements by big name “african rappers” (btw who the heck is he talking about here) and hip hop moguls. So it wasn’t enough for him to be rapping to the white suburban kids who he targets b/c they still wouldn’t drive his sales without the backing of authentic (read=black) hip hoppers.
    Furthermore, i get really damn tired of hearing that white subruban kids are the only ones buying hip hop music. That arguement has always felt icky b/c it once again suggests that the only way POC can be successful is through white people.

  32. Aishtamid wrote:

    I agree with you that this guy is a douche. I think so mainly because his posturing makes him look like he thinks he’s superior to blacks. Maybe he might have had point about black rappers not “giving back,” but the way he said it and the way he acts makes it very problematic. It’s because of the way he acts and not his race that makes me feel like it’s a problem.

    And after all, Roth shows some astonishing ignorance with his blacks and Darfur comment. That kinda put me over the edge. It’s utterly uncalled for. But would it be wrong on principle for a privileged white person to rap if they were doing it with respect? I don’t think so.

    I didn’t check on this, but with a name like Asher Roth I’m 99% sure he’s a fellow member of “the tribe.” That’s an angle no one has mentioned so far. To be fair, Roth never does either. But he’s a negative chapter in the long history of white Jews appropriating African-American culture. I also know of examples where the appropriation has gone the other way. But in the 1920s, some of the first whites to like Jazz, the ancestors of the hipsters, were Jewish.

    Also, what about Jewish artists like Matisyahu, who appropriates black culture by making reggae music, but does so in an uplifting and positive manner? He actually attracts some black people to his concerts even though virtually all he talks about is being Jewish. Matisyahu never once mentions race or privilege in anything he does. There are also guys like 50 Shekel rap in a pretty lighthearted but in the end respectful manner. They know they aren’t black, they don’t try to be and they don’t seem to think they’re any better than blacks. They don’t rub privilege in your face.

    Finally, I’d like to bring up the point that some Jewish organizations have appropriated rap and reggae to make pro-Israel songs (propaganda, really) in an attempt to appeal to young people. Check out the song called “One love, one home.” The played that incessantly on the bus during my Birthright trip to Israel. If anything goes against the spirit of hip-hop, it’s that, even more so than Asher Roth.

    What are your opinions? BTW, really sorry for the crazy long post. Just wanted to get these things in there.

  33. Aishtamid wrote:

    @AintIawoman: I know how to explain his comment on blacks and Africa: ridiculous ignorance and a superiority complex.

  34. pointofagreement wrote:

    There, there folks.

    Let’s not get all crazy.

    This marketing nuget will pass like a kidney stone soon enough. Like all those bleepin’ Ed Hardy shirts, the moment he’s everywhere is the moment he starts disappearing. His 15 minutes does raise an interesting specter though.

    What would happen if cultural identity was more of a factor in among hip hop fandom?

    Do the artist’s double down on creative expression? revert to social/civic analysis in the manner of the late 80’s and early 90’s? Or go headfirst into the “‘bottles at the club, love your lady-lumps’” bog?

    Could make for interesting vieweing.

    Rest assured fellow POC: you’re still the margin by which hip, cool and happening
    is defined in America. It’s just about the only value the mainstrem places on our opinions.

    And that pang of panic we’re you’re feeling?

    You know the one….that’s making us think how bad it would be if the proverbial ‘they’ took hip-hop away from ‘us’? Ask yourself, do you even want to keep it?

  35. Big Man wrote:

    Why black folks gotta be responsible for Africa?

    Were we the ones who effed it up?

    Come on now, I was always taught that when you break something you either fix it, or you pay for the damage.

    Last time I checked, white folks were the ones that broke Africa.

  36. j.ceasless wrote:

    @ Walt

    Interesting, since I have often heard the argument that the “East Coast” style was really jacked from the West Coast. I can sort of hear this when I listen to early Freestyle Fellowship. I’m not saying I totally believe it, just that from my understanding it is not quite as simple as saying fans of complex lyricism are only digging an “East Coast style.” That’s way too simplistic a formulation.

    Re: simple vs complex. Maybe we are mincing definitions? Complexity for lyrics is more than just the scheme, its the content and the plays on words and the delivery, the style, swagger, etc. The industry is pushing crap, that is my opinion and it’s not hard to get a cosign on that.

    Of course hip hop isn’t dead or even stagnating, but you wouldn’t be able to tell that from listening to the radio.

  37. j.ceasless wrote:

    You know what, I take that back about the radio. There are some interesting trends developing even on there. But they mainly go by the names Kanye and Lil Wayne ;)

  38. Arturo wrote:

    If there’s any silver lining to be found in the midst of the Asherocalypse (thanks for the term, LP) … well, actually, there’s two:

    1) The current media cycle virtually ensures that this guy will go from MTV darling to being the opening act at your local county fair before the next Olympics. And I think this guy knows that, deep down.
    2) Next Eminem? Hardly. Try ‘Next Kid Rock’ or ‘Next Jimmy Buffett.’ In each case, we’re seeing cultural appropriation used for a quick record-sales boost, followed by the artist eventually turning away from said culture: both KR and JB have migrated toward country-oriented presentations in the past few years.

  39. AjDOW wrote:

    Ashep Roth doesn’t seem any different than bands that perform under ( independent) racist record labels. He just does it with rap and some ppl will buy into.
    I feel, rap stopped being a “black experience” or “black thing” when it went mainstream. Now it belongs to everybody to do what they will with it. Its background does not exclude anyone from participating or enjoying it.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if he became a comedian later. I doubt rap is his thing, more like a stepping stone into something else.

  40. Stef wrote:

    I cannot thank you enough for writing this!!

  41. Sean wrote:

    Walt Byars #15

    It is a popular meme, which seems most prevalent among white “backpacker” hip hop fans, that the “real” hip hop is about poverty or race or politics. Not only is this totally ignorant of hip hop history but racist. Its an orientalist assumption that any authentic manifestation of black culture must be about these topics.

    This is not an historical first: In the late 1950s, early 1960s, there was a burgeoning interest in the Blues by music enthusiasts, especially in Great Britain. To this end, black American blues artists were brought over to perform in England -at a time when they couldn’t even walk in the front door of some clubs in the U.S.

    A big premium was placed on “authenticity” so these musicians were expected to be hard-lived, alcoholic, illiterate, etc. If said performer was not, then his authenticity was questioned and critiqued.

    B.B. King once mentioned the fact that he always wears a tuxedo at his concerts was in part, to defy stereotypical expectations of the “down and dirty bluesman.”

    You are correct… new millenium, same meme.

  42. Thom wrote:

    Reading the discussions about Roth the past two days have been interesting. As an overweight white in his thirties who enjoys rap, I find myself drawn back to older stuff, or stuff where I feel like someone is finding a musical and lyrical identity that singles them out to my ear. I just have no desire to seek Roth out, because the identity he is forging is…well, weak.

    I like Public Enemy because they challenge me to face things that I would not seen in my own experiences. I like the Roots because they seem to constantly be evolving musically. I like Jurassic 5 because they are just fun and pretty upbeat. I didn’t need a white guy rapping to enjoy the music and lyrics (of course, I also like Aesop Rock, and did not know he was white until the quote from Jeremy R. Levine).

    Thanks for the thought provoking post. Thanks for saving me the trouble of checking Asher Roth out.

  43. Sean wrote:

    AjDOW wrote:

    I feel, rap stopped being a “black experience” or “black thing” when it went mainstream. Now it belongs to everybody to do what they will with it. Its background does not exclude anyone from participating or enjoying it.

    History repeats itself. To many people, Elvis epitomizes Rock & Roll, Eric Clapton epitomizes the blues, No Doubt epitomizes reggae, and Kenny G epitomizes jazz.

    The big wheel keeps on turning…

  44. uu wrote:

    umm…why does he keep mentioning “African” rappers and not “African-American” and “African” rappers? I find that little odd.

  45. Kaonashi wrote:

    Bah, typical attention whoring douchebag that wants desperately to be accepted by the same group he slags off. It’s so transparent, even I can tell. :/

    He lost my attention when he claimed that he was “Classic White” or some such nonsense in an interview. The Beastlie Boys, Mike Skinner, and Eminem have more talent in the material they throw away than this guy does on this best day. He’s like the Weird Al Yankovich of the Rap world but without the longevity. I anticipate him saying more and more race-bait things in the future in order to keep people talking. Move along now, nothing to see here.

    Aishtamid : I can’t completely answer all of your questions, but I read somewhere in an interview Matisyahu did that he “creates music to uplift the human spirit” and I think it’s that purity in his music that attracts so many. Personally, I think it’s an issue of organic vs manufactured.

  46. ansel wrote:

    Roth called Africa the “motherland” in that interview with the AP. Honestly wtf.

    I’ve seen a few interviews with him and every now and then he spouts some vague crap that makes it sound like it cares about social justice in some way, like he’s trying to bridge some divide or some other nonsense… it’s really annoying. His flow can be mildly creative in places and the track about his family was allright., but rest of his album was crap to me.

    The only reason he’s famous is that he’s white and privileged and someone thinks they can make money off rap about that stuff.

    At least a lot of good underground stuff is going around, as always.

  47. AintIAWoman wrote:

    Just a sidenote, but I always liked Murs’ “And This Is For…” because he describes a lot of issues we’re talking about here, and his somewhat uncomfortable relationship with white kids that dig his music, etc. I believe the final lines are entirely about white appropriation of music

    yes it is jazz and yes it is the blues
    and yes it is the exact same way they did rock
    but I refuse to watch the same thing happen to hip-hop

  48. bill wrote:

    [Mod Note - There are two ways to send tips - via email or via del.icio.us. If you continue posting off-topic comments, you will be banned. - LDP]

  49. Safiya Outlines wrote:

    Kaonashi – I’d actually say Weird Al was a better rapper.

    In fact Weird Al’s “White and Nerdy” rap song was better (flow-wise e.tc.) than Charmillionaire’s original. I think that marked a low point for modern rap.

  50. geo wrote:

    it’s as though he’s making a mockery of rap.

    i’m a bit biased against white rappers, i must admit, because i find it difficult to discern between them being genuine and/or funny and plain ol’ mockery.

  51. jen* wrote:

    I’ve heard ‘I Love College’ several times [it's popular on the radio here in Podunk, SC], and not once did I ever think this fellow was rapping.

    I never thought of the music as hip-hop or rap.

    He seemed a novelty [most likely one-hit wonder] and while the tune of the song is catchy, I hate the words.

    I’m just a lil weirded out that this is supposedly rap. And pissed about that “African” rappers comment. And a little afraid of what might come next after that atrocious How Does It Feel? sendup. ::shudder::

  52. deathblossom wrote:

    @ansel

    I know. SERIOUSLY, THE MOTHERLAND? I almost flipped the script reading that. Makes me wish I could be there to smack him across his smarmy, mocking face. That whole comment was calculated to be a mockery of black people, like something I’d hear some “oppressed” white college male crying about while drunk. Honestly, he sounds like a real life troll.

    I think Soderberg and Levine combined get to the heart of my problem with this guy. It’s not that he’s talking and educating about suburbia, it’s that he’s sick of having to support black people who can’t support themselves and then don’t give him his due, so he’s retaliating by pushing “Yep, white, privileged, and proud of it”. “I love College” is offensive from beginning to end. It’s basically the meathead version of “White and Nerdy” except not nearly as self-deprecating. I actually made myself watch some of the video instead of just reading the lyrics and I hated him that much more. He’s that cheeky white guy you all know and you all hate, but you all have to live with because the rest of the people living around you either don’t find him offensive or feel like your anger is easier to manage than his cluelessness routine.

  53. gatamala wrote:

    This guy is the living embodiment of white hipster irony that is dissected here.

    He hates hip hop. He hates black folks. The 21st century Asa Yoelson sans cork.

    Nothing more.

  54. sfsinger wrote:

    Asher Roth presents a much bigger problem: the credit white artists get for appropriating black music and the ongoing misogyny and attacks on Black women. Why do Black people fall all over themselves when they listen to a white artist who states Aretha Franklin was an influence but ignore an actual Black artist who might be doing something just as interesting (and original) musically? We’ve rejected our heritage (or don’t it) and have no appreciation for it.

    Please check out my conversations:
    Studying African-American History is Vital For Our (Re)claiming It From the Culture Vultures http://snipurl.com/hehmh

    and

    Deploying A Little Negro Spirit: When White Artists Go Black http://snipurl.com/hbqhc

    and
    Deploying A Little Negro Spirit: Gotta Have Soul http://tinyurl.com/ca3ze6

  55. Wendi Muse wrote:

    i know it’s been said already, but i am all over the stanky leg. i’ve been trying to teach it to many of my brazilian friends who are convinced that americans can’t dance, and they still can’t do it. i always point them to southern party rap as the most immediate way to debunk that stereotype. :-)

    but on the note of asher roth…i found out about him via, of all places, gawker, which was a sign in itself. i watched one of the videos, but failed to be impressed or captivated by his performance. oh well. there will always be below mediocre folks who make it to the top via hype, but the fall is harder than the climb.

  56. Mahsino wrote:

    1. I feel so old. What is this stanky leg of which you speak? Oh, wait. I’m watching the YouTube. Sigh.

    2. You could have stopped the article after the African Rappers quote. If anything has ever summarized the douchiness of a performer- that is it.

    3. I hate “I Love College”. I have never had the time to do half that crap he’s talking about. Mommy and Daddy ain’t paying for my education or leisure. Let’s just rename it “I Love Privilege” and call it a day.

  57. elle the elephant wrote:

    The main problem with Asher Roth isn’t himself per se, its what he represents: the future of hip-hop. I wouldn’t be surprised if the record labels tried to create some more “plain white” rappers in the mode of Asher Roth, so suburban whites can have “someone they can relate to in hip-hop” over those violent,primitive, ghetto negroes that white kids supposedly can’t relate to. If it can happen to Rock n Roll and Jazz, it can happen to hiphop, in fact, it is on its way to happening right now as commercialised as rap is. You watch, 30 years from now there won’t be any Black faces in hip-hop, and people,when they think of hip-hop, won’t be thinking about Jay-Z or Ice Cube, they will think about some white artist that appropriated the style.

    Another problem I have with Asher Roth is that he represents how the modern music industry has zero creativity. I listen to a part of that “I love college” song and it was just boring and predictable, the same friendly and inoffensive crap I can get on the radio. But record labels are willing to push this crap over real rappers like Murs,Cannibus,Necro,Jedi Mind Tricks, Immortal Technique,Street Military, or Tech-N9ne because its “friendly” and “marketable” and “un-contreversial”. Seriously, support your independent label, not the major corporate pigs.

  58. Yonah wrote:

    “I didn’t check on this, but with a name like Asher Roth I’m 99% sure he’s a fellow member of “the tribe.” That’s an angle no one has mentioned so far. ”

    And I was hoping nobody ever would. :( The shande!

    For what it’s worth, though, Aish, I don’t think your characterisation of Jews appropriating and white-ifying Black culture is really fair. For a lot of that history, Jews were anything but representative of the white establishment Matisyahu’s relationship to reggae and black reggae artists is also far more complicated and, from what I understand, mutual than a simple Elvisesque ripoff.

  59. CrzyCatDC wrote:

    I’m going to have to agree with Kandeezie on this one. He’s not rapping at all, has no appreciation for the art form. He’s simply using the medium of hip hop to make fun of our culture.

    This is sickening: “Culturally, Em was almost a black guy. My background is more stereotypically white.” That’s just great, Asher.

    He basically equates poverty and hardship with being black. Funny he points out that he’s stereotypically white, but doesn’t realize that at the same time, he’s stereotyping black people.

  60. CrzyCatDC wrote:

    @Big Man

    “Why black folks gotta be responsible for Africa?”

    THANK YOU!!!

  61. RCHOUDH wrote:

    Since I never heard of this guy I just happened to google him and he looks so…hipsterish. And he acts like one too with his asinine comments on black rappers and women. Good thing not much of his units got pushed. This reminds me of the time KFed tried to come out as a legit white rapper even though no one took him seriously, being Britney’s house husband and all. But at least he never (to the best of my knowledge) never said any douchey racist things to put down the genre he was trying to break into.

  62. ansel wrote:

    Oh and I should add – obviously the messed up thing is there are a lot of talented white rappers besides Eminem and Aesop Rock who aren’t obnoxious about their privilege. For some reason we don’t hear about them. Toby of Inverse, Grynch, Doomtree, Braille, Move.meant, Wreckonize, RA Scion of Common Market, and more… I’ve played all those folks on local radio. Don’t sleep.

  63. atlasien wrote:

    If anyone else has a sick desire to listen to some more Cringe Rap check out Hi-Caliber the Conservative Rapper.

  64. gatamala wrote:

    elle~

    you are very right. Look at atlasien’s link.

    Mashed up with a book titled, “Barack Obama the Half-Blood Prince”.

    I blame those who said hip hop isn’t a black art form..it’s “universal”.

    That guy trying to nod his head looks like he has vertigo.

  65. Jason wrote:

    While I can understand the aggravation we may feel with Roth’s marketing angle I don’t see how it’s any different than Jeezy or anyone else claiming to speak for “The Hood” as a “Street Reporter”. Roth’s just the “Suburban Reporter” and can probably relate to the white surburban experience better than even a black surburan-bread rapper. As you even hinted in the title of your article, those blacks raised in the suburbs are “strangers in paradise” and probably don’t relate the details quite as well as an Asher Roth could, the punchlines are likely more relatable and I’m not sure your average surburban black has the same fascination for beer pong and cornhole

  66. Whit wrote:

    I have nothing substantive to add, just a wish that Asher Roth goes and finds a rock to hide under again. And soon.

  67. m.dot wrote:

    It’s Bigger Than Asher Roth

    -The fact that he is a middle class kid, rapping about being in college reminded me that because he isn’t a Black man, he isn’t force
    to buy into the Gangsta/Thug/Ho trinity
    I wouldn’t necessarily construct that as his privilage, he is being just exactly who is is, a middle class white dude.

    -I found his comments about Africa interesting. Yes, he is politically undereducated, many people are..
    However, when was the last time you heard a POPULAR rapper criticize another rapper for being politically uninvolved? No one within popular music does this? As a white man, it would interesting to see it coming from him, because we are socialized to treat the words that come out of white men’s mouth’s seriously.

    If he came out, talking shit about Jay Z, Weezy’s, Jeezy’s, T-pains and God knows who else’s hyper consumption and zero accountability, a broader conversation about the purpose of Black music and the responsibility that Black artists have to the Black community could possibly take place.

    This DJ Drama mixtape song was interesting:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vp50arOSlAY

    I hope Asher Roth hangs out w/ Chuck D, ta he he he, becomes a bit more politically educated,
    and starts talking shit about rappers.

  68. Matt wrote:

    Aishtamid, yeah, Roth is a MOT. Yonah’s right, though – a shande. Check out Shemspeed. I agree that Matisyahu — and this applies to pretty much everything at Shemspeed as well as some more random stuff like MC Paul Barman — is mostly respectful in his appropriations, but I also think it helps tremendously that he appropriates from traditions that appropriated heavily from Jewish traditions. I have mixed feelings about moving discussion in that direction, though. It gets so complicated that Roth would become a minor tangent — even if I do want to complicate the simply stated claim that he’s white.

    It might be the more important thing, though, that Matisyahu is clear about who he is. I disagree with many of the overly broad arguments about white people rapping that get made. (Just a peek in that direction, see Michael Berube’s post about musicians being “always already” sell outs.) But Roth gets into the weirdness of authenticity. There is no such thing as “authentic,” and yet he feels inauthentic in every way.

  69. brownskinlady wrote:

    @Big Man

    Just thinking some more about your joke, “Why black folks gotta be responsible for Africa? Were we the ones who effed it up? Come on now, I was always taught that when you break something you either fix it, or you pay for the damage. Last time I checked, white folks were the ones that broke Africa.”

    It unsettled me when I read it, and it took this long for me to put my finger on why.

    As an American woman of color working in international ‘development’ on the African continent, I am always disappointed to hear Americans–especially fellow PoC–detach themselves from African issues. Yes, colonialism may be mythicized as how ‘white folks’ ‘broke Africa’ a long time ago, but there are plenty of contemporary issues Americans and other Westerners (white, black, brown, of all races and diaspora) are connected to in the ‘developing’ world.

    Maybe they are not our direct fault, but given the global hierarchy Americans and other Westerners often benefit from the exploitation of those in countries with less power, finances, resources, whatever. PoC in the US may not feel directly culpable, but I imagine it is similar to how Asher Roth feels about his role in broadcasting and excusing his unexamined privilege for millions of other people.

    I know that PoC activists in the US often say we are working on our own problems first–which I get–but folks from ‘Western’ countries have to acknowledge the privilege that comes with our passport and nationality. Even if we may be systematically discriminated on in our home countries.

    Frankly, I know a lot of folks from the ‘developing’ world who would say Americans deconstructing the racist remarks of a white nobody rapper on a blog is indicative of how much time/luxury/privilege we have on our hands.

    Not that I think we shouldn’t analyze media (or that Asher Roth’s racist comments are even coming close to suggesting these points). Just saying that as ‘western’ anti-racists and activists, we need to think globally—and not disengage from our own privilege and obligations as we critique others.

    Fault Asher Roth for assuming his fellow citizens are African and ‘more’ responsible to ‘their motherland’ than him, but don’t assume as a Black American you didn’t ‘eff it up’ either…

    (sorry for the rant. otherwise loving the comments.)

  70. leia wrote:

    @ brownskinlady I don’t think black folks over here that live in the hood is by any means benefiting from the privilege of being american.

    for their own country is basically undermining and destroying them and other folks also, so i wouldn’t necessarily say we had a hand in it too.

    also, because of that kind of situation mentioned above, without money, resources, and attainable knowledge of such situations outside the U.S, it would be hard to ‘change’ anything that you technically hand no hand in.

    Yes black folks who know about things going on in African countries benefit from their american status but even then we’re busy tryin’ to make ends meet.

    In the end i feel you, but you have to consider the types of problems african-americans have going here that disables us from helping out our bretheren. folks over here dyin’ and that won’t lift manyspirits about other things.

    my rebuttal.

  71. leia wrote:

    Also what i meant to write in my previous comment was that, i too felt a A-holely vibe from Roth when i saw the ” i love college” video on friggin MTV…

  72. R-SON the Voice wrote:

    I’ve spent the last 15 years of my life having every variation this argument with any number of people. To me it seems rather simple; it makes more money for corporate interests for Black Males to portray themselves as coons and criminals than it every would for us to be shown in the broad spectrum of individuals we are. There are masses of educated, talented, child-raising, job-having MCs with lots to say to uplift and educate the populace. But it’s assumed that they don’t sell ringtones or ad revenue so they aren’t given any shine.
    Since its been determined that HipHop is a huge money maker, to give it a new “face” every couple of years, a new white guy is trotted out. Whatever their skill level, because there’s no denying that Eminem can spit like crazy, any white guy is going to be well received. What’s different is that he is allowed to be whoever he wants to be and rep whatever he wants to, whereas for Black males we have to fit into the money-making-minstrel mode.
    It astounds me that another black-created culture and artform has fallen to the hands of a power structure that doesn’t give a damn about it beyond its ability to make a buck.

  73. DHood wrote:

    @Jason

    I’m not so sure black suburban rappers being a “fish out of water” affords them the right to rep the hood and talk about gats and such. I don’t see how they relate any more than Roth, or how Roth relates anymore to college than Kidz in the Hall, for example.

    One of the guys linked to in this post wrote another post related to your comment: http://socialsciencelite.blogspot.com/2009/04/fck-where-you-at-kid-its-where-you-from.html

    There’s definitely more to this story, but I thought it made some sense.

  74. Fiqah wrote:

    @brownskinlady:

    “Frankly, I know a lot of folks from the ‘developing’ world who would say Americans deconstructing the racist remarks of a white nobody rapper on a blog is indicative of how much time/luxury/privilege we have on our hands.”

    Amen. Amen. And amen. So many PoC’s are unaware of their First World/Western (ack, these words!) privelige because it doesn’t become apparent that they have it until they travel to a developing country. Not to trivialize anything discussed here (because I do love Racialicious so), but really, if you used CLEAN WATER to flush an indoor toilet today, you’ve got it easier than 70 percent of the global population.

    Asher Roth’s an uninformed dick to (incorrectly) target super-wealthy Black rappers for not being globally-aware. But a larger theme emerges here: as aware First World/developed nation/Western/other problematic label folks, what is our responsibility to people in developing nations? Because, however indirectly, globally speaking we ARE a nation of oppressors.

    Anyway…sorry about the derail.

  75. Latoya Peterson wrote:

    ***Mod Note*****

    Reminder:

    This is in our comment mod policy:

    8. Don’t respond to a post or comment by saying “why don’t you focus on some real issues like the war/starving children in Africa/police brutality/etc.” Newsflash: this is a blog about race and pop culture. If you’re not interested in discussing the intersection of those two things, please go elsewhere.

    If you don’t want to talk about a nobody white rapper, here’s a hint – DON’T COMMENT HERE. There are thousands of other blogs that don’t focus on pop culture, go to one of those. Further comments in this vein will be deleted.

  76. Fiqah wrote:

    @LDP: Oops! Sorry about the tangent! I’ll stay on topic going forward (well, as on topic as I know how).

  77. brownskinlady wrote:

    @Latoya

    Didn’t mean to be off-topic. Just trying to introduce a more nuanced discussion on the intersections of nationality and place in the global hierarchy alongside race as we look at Asher Roth’s comments on ‘African’ rappers giving ‘back’–since Roth co-opts the rhetoric of American privilege while clearly subverting his own responsibility and diverting it to black rappers.

    @ leia
    I definitely hear your rebuttal, and it’s important (but clearly a whole other conversation not related to this post). In reference to the post, I was just uncomfortable with the road we were going down with Big Man’s comment, which seemed to reinforce other systems of hierarchy and privilege as we problematized Roth’s remarks.

  78. Ron wrote:

    I think he can make music just like anyone else. It’s terrible music, but I don’t think it’s an representative of some sort of mockery of black music anymore than white jazz artists or white blues rockers who don’t “pay homage” to the craft.

    Asher Roth is simply a marketing gimmick and well, that’s fine. Lots of those exist in all sorts of genres. But like someone said, he’s such an easy target.

    Given all of the hype, he didn’t exactly sell a ton of albums. His star might be more like a comet.

  79. Julia wrote:

    I’m really interested in a conversation that is going on underneath this conversation: I can’t quite put my finger on it, but it’s something about rap/hip hop and authenticity. The questions that seem to be percolating beneath the surface are:
    who does rap (or hip hop) belong to?
    what makes a rapper/hip hop artist authentic?
    to what degree is hip hop/rap only “real” when the artist is black and/or working class?

    I don’t have an opinion on any of these questions myself, but I would like to hear what all of you think.

    And just to be clear, this is in now way a veiled attempt at devending Asher, who sounds like a Class-A idiot

  80. DocDre wrote:

    LP!

    You can’t understand the Stanky Leg, Ricky Bobby, or Halle Berry until you see the kids dancing to it. Watching them dance and gyrate reminds me that hip hop is FOR DANCING…not just for head nodding or open mics. Hearing the music outside of its context robs it of the lovely stylistic urgency and kinetic grace. plus…you old.

    *day late..dollar short…still on point*

  81. R-SON the Voice wrote:

    “who does rap (or hip hop) belong to?
    what makes a rapper/hip hop artist authentic?
    to what degree is hip hop/rap only “real” when the artist is black and/or working class?”

    Great questions, Julia

    From a HipHop cat’s perspective, I’d say that it belongs to those of us who live it, love and represent it in our day to day living. It’s for sharing with anyone with anyone who want s to know it and enjoy. Those who only want to exploit it for financial gain are not welcome.

    Authenticity comes when you are presenting yourself as who you really are. If you never sold crack, why would you rap about doing so? If the case is that you are a great storyteller and can tell a dope story about drug life, in the form of rhymes and verses, then so be it. But don’t act as though it’s your life. That’s disingenuous and fake.

    You don’t have to be black or working -class to be “real”. I know just as many “real” HipHop cats (DJs, MCs, Producers, Graf writers, B-Boys) that are white guys, as I do that are black. What matters is a person’s individual dedication to the culture.

  82. Seriously People wrote:

    Really people…. disgusting???

    Asher Roth isn’t your typical rapper… Everyone keeps talking about the fact that Asher has no room to talk about what it was like growing up on the streets and a hard life of selling drugs and what not. But you see the thing is…. he doesn’t. The guy raps about the way he grew up, he doesn’t try and fit the genre that is rap right now about chains, girls, and money. Asher Roth is rapping about the regular shit a guy like him grew up with. He doesn’t claim to be something he’s not… ever. He’s just having fun with his skills as a rapper.

    As an African American I’m disgusted with the outright prejudice being thrown at Asher Roth when he simply hasn’t done anything to warrant it.

    If would be a different story altogether if Asher was wrapping about growing up on the streets but he isn’t so leave it at that. At least give the guy credit where it’s due, the fact that he’s not trying to be something he’s not like so many rappers do these days.

    O, and if Jay-Z’s got some love for Asher and Andre 3000…. he’s gotta be doing something right

  83. brownstocking wrote:

    @82 So you want to give Asher a cookie cuz he’s not a “wigga”? Um, no. He’s wack, and he’s a symptom. Since he’s the indicator, we’re addressing him. And Jay-Z and Andre3000, marketing geniuses in their own right, endorsing him, just makes me think it’s about the ducats moreso than a lifestyle or genre.

    He’s young, he may or may not be racist (Jay Smooth was far more eloquent that I could hope to be).

    Like someone else mentioned above, there is something just under my skin about him. 1)His interview on 106 and Park(my sistafriend loves BET) was problematic with that “freestyle”on eating healthy–upper middle class kid lecturing on not feeding your babies Mickey Ds?! GTFOHWTBS 2) Doesn’t seem that “conscious” and the videos just reinforce stupid/harmful tropes. 3) Why does he consider himself “white” and not Jewish? The last one I’m not weighing in on, but it lingers in the back of my head.

    I hope he fades quickly. I’m afraid he’s just let the dogs out, as far as other mediocre people being forced on my ears. And I would still name my child Asher, I love that name.

  84. n wrote:

    Gee, I was quoted and didnt even know it.

    “Emily wrote:

    I actually smacked my forehead when I read this – “Em was almost a black guy.” Wha? ”

    I mentioned that in the discussion of “white trash”, “trash” and non-white are considered synonymous. And by trash I suppose I mean poor, uneducated and sexually “loose”.

    It is a problem when being black and being socially and economically disadvantaged are seen as the same thing.

    When black people aren’t poor or uneducated or “lower class” then people tend to see them as non-black or as exceptions. And one of the consequences of this is that young black people feel that education, success and any attempts to be part of mainstream America mean will make them less/other than black.

    Let me ask this? If being black and being poor aren’t equivalent, and if there are rappers who are suburbanites and relatively privileged does that mean they aren’t “allowed” to rap, or does their lack of white privilege make it ok, whereas a white rapper from more fortunate circumstances just aint allowed not because he didn’t grow up poor, but because he isnt black?

  85. Melli wrote:

    Well I haven’t yet got a chance to finish the article but I just want to say that hip hop has really gone downhill and I’m 18 years old and saying this. My ipod consists mostly of hip hop from the 80’s and 90’s and even some from the early 2000’s but after that its all crap and it died very recently. I remember when I was young there was still some good stuff out. Maybe it wasn’t as “deep” as the last generations but there was still a message there. Now MAINSTREAM hip hop is all about nothing… && this means either one of two things. 1) times have changed and we no longer have problems so there’s nothing important to rap about or 2) people have changed and stopped caring about whats important. i think its more likely 2 and moreso the audience of hip hop has changed. when hip hop first sprung up the intended audience was “the people”, specifically black people. it was a story written by us for us and it was a way talk about issues that often went unnoticed. then it became mainstream and for a while it was all good until it became all about money and entertainment and rappers stopped caring about spreading social consciousness. there are still amazing hip hop artists out there but their stuff isnt mainstream and even mainstream artists produce some real music w/ real meaning but it doesnt get the same play as the “bad” stuff because the intended audience is now white suburbia and they dont want to hear about black struggle… heck maybe even we dont want to hear about our own struggle.