Comments

1. Winn wrote:

   Carmen,

   Great thought-provkoing post in a concise format. I just wish you had another forum in which to present it. Reading the comments there just made me tired. All the usual suspects showed up in the first few comments: the shock and amazement at the idea that anyone would expect Obama to “choose a side”, the seizing on Obama’s Father’s Day speech as evidence that racism is over and the black community’s problems are all self-imposed, the idea that we are living in some “post-racial” la-la land in which the only people who keep this “race thing’ going are blacks, who will never be satisfied even though they have affirmative action, government set-asides, and, let’s see, “the ever-present threat of discrimination lawsuits”. It’s a wonder the world keeps turning with all these disgruntled blacks whining and complaining while they are handed everything, and all they do in return is have babies out of wedlock and commit violent crimes. This had to be my favorite comment of all though: “Outside of Bill Cosby, he is the first black politician to confront the black community to take ownership of their social problems which leads to their financial problems and the black on black crimes that lead to their imprisonment”. Wow…just wow. And when exactly did Bill Cosby become a poli…why the hell am I even asking? *slams head on desk* The few semi-intelligent responses to your post must have felt like a cold and bracing shower after that hot mess. Better you than me, hon.

   Posted 10 Jul 2008 at 5:32 pm ¶

2. Bob Simpson wrote:

   I would have felt better about Barack Obama’s Father’s Day speech if he had taken a quick run over to a predominantly white church and delivered a similar message with this addition: That white parents have a responsibility to instill strong anti-racist values into their children.

   Please note that I did not say “color-blind” or other euphemisms for the racial status quo that preserves rather than dismantles the white privilege that is one of the sick legacies of slavery times.

   Posted 10 Jul 2008 at 5:35 pm ¶

3. Tariq Nelson wrote:

   I think that part of the underlying trouble some have with Obama is not the fact that he is half white, but that he is NOT a descendant of slaves. With that being the case he may not have the passion for issues in the black American (meaning descendants of slaves) community.

   My trouble is not there, but that the meaning of “African-American” is very obscure and those of us that are the descendants of slaves have become “generic”.

   In other words, Nigerians, Senegalese, Somalis, Kenyans etc can all claim to be “African-American” but the difference with those groups is that they all have homelands, home cultures and languages and the descendants of slaves are cut off from these things.

   Obviously I am speculating, but this may be part of Rev. Jackson’s problem when he says that Obama (essentially an outsider) is “talking down” to blacks (meaning the descendants of slaves). I don’t think it has anything to do with this white ancestry.

   Posted 10 Jul 2008 at 5:35 pm ¶

4. Hokayshenao wrote:

   The words black and white are strong to the public. It is hard for anyone to fit in either category. Barack Obama has the responsiblity of anybody else to use his favoritism.

   Posted 10 Jul 2008 at 10:56 pm ¶

5. Mickey wrote:

   @ Tariq Nelson

   You shined a light on some things for me. I agree that the term African American has become kind of..generic.

   As a personal choice, I refer to myself as Black American. While I am descended from slaves, no one in my family has been from the continent Africa in 250+ years. All of our traditions are Southern/Texan. We celebrate Juneteenth with pride.

   Black American describes who I am . I’m Black. I was born in America. The only connection I have with the continent of Africa is an ancestor long since forgotten and skin color.

   Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 8:57 am ¶

6. Aaron wrote:

   I have to disagree with many of the commenters over there saying that this election shouldn’t be about race. I’m glad that they’re not overtly afraid of a black president, but really, they’re just putting on another show of “colorblindness”.

   This election is going to be about race. Of course, the war, the economy, etc etc are important issues, but to me, and many others, race is too. We just need to make sure the dialogue is not hijacked by racial fear mongering. One reason, perhaps the biggest reason, that I support Obama is because I feel that having a black president, and having him as president, will help us advance discussions and perceptions on race in this country. And in this country, where so many of our problems have strong racial undertones, almost nothing could be more important. When you look at poverty, education, health care, and similar issues, you can’t tackle the problems while ignoring race.

   Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 9:59 am ¶

7. Tariq Nelson wrote:

   @ Mickey

   I am in the exact same situation. I think the movie Soul Food painted an excellent picture of our culture

   Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 12:19 pm ¶

8. coco wrote:

   I still use the term African American. I think is describes the descendants of slaves who were largely divided from their original nationalities. I identify as an American of African descent because I am removed from more accurately naming my ancestor’s nationalities.

   Obama could identify as an American of Kenyan descent, but he also has experienced life as a black man in America. Although he doesn’t have ancestral ties to slavery, he did attend an African American church and sat through some 20 years of sermons by a pastor who addressed the historical, social and economic challenges presented to the African American community.

   So, he’s not descended from slaves, but he isn’t entirely ignorant of, or divorced from the effects of racism in American either.

   Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 1:20 pm ¶

9. Natalie wrote:

   Great article by Carmen as usual but why is the AC360 blog shut down for comments already? Anderson has his joint on lockdown!

   I really wanted to address the comment made by the woman who stated that race would continue to be an issue until more interracial marriages occur…. apparently she’s been MIA because I could have sworn that statistically interracial marriages were on the rise. Yet no change… hmmmmmm. I wonder what her next plan of action is.

   Also, the Mike in NYC guy was in denial…. he was totally on the “fear the black man” bandwagon. I never understood why Caucasian people become so enraged over affirmative action. They have to realize that though we have progressed in some instances ITS STILL NEEDED. The policy was in existence for a reason. No one asks for handouts but if people can’t get a fair shot… there has to be some sort of foot in the door advantage given. I could go on with that topic for eons but I won’t. *deep sigh*

   Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 1:32 pm ¶

10. SarahSimone wrote:

    @ Aaron

    I think it’s an excellent point that so many of our problems are tied up in race. Race and class in this country seem to be in a very messy relationship to one another, and I often find that when people I know talk about “people on welfare stealing from the government” or “women having babies they can’t take care of” etc. what they really mean is “non white people”.

    But I think you would definitely have to add the war to a list of problems tied in with race. The way the War on Terror is conducted – racial profiling, the treatment of detainees. I wonder if we would be having these same arguments about what constitutes torture if we were at war with a predominantly white nation. I suppose we might treat them as badly, but it seems to me we treat Middle Eastern people here, and abroad, with a special kind of disdain, disrespect, and fear.

    Not to mention that as far as American soldiers go, the army targets low income areas. I don’t know the numbers, so I could definitely be wrong, but it makes sense to me that if a disproportionate amount of Black, Hispanic, or otherwise non white people are poor, then they are most likely to be recruited by our armed forces.

    Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 2:22 pm ¶

11. Aaron wrote:

    Sarah, you’re absolutely right. I actually thought about mentioning the war, and some other issues, but was having trouble finding the right words, and didn’t feel the need to mention every single problem that is related to race. There are so many. The war is another painfully obvious example though, as well as foreign policy in general.

    Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 3:05 pm ¶

12. lxy wrote:

    To be frank, there are many illusions about Barack Obama. He is like a cipher or a blank slate upon which people can project their greatest hopes … or fears.

    Believe it or not, there are significant sections of White mainstream America who fear that Obama is some kind of Black (Muslim) militant in disguise. Though this idea is laughable given even a cursory examination of Obama’s voting record, it does reveal the depth of White paranoia in the USA.

    Then, there are the illusions that many Progressives hold about Obama. His call for “Change that you can believe in” has resonated with the younger generation and others who long for a political savior–or at least hope–after 8 long years of the Cheney/Bush Regime.

    Sadly, these hopes will most likely be shattered if Obama is in fact elected. Indeed, the hopes and fears of both groups mentioned above will probably not be born out.

    Some of the most cogent and eloquent analyses of Barack Obama come not from the US Corporate media like CNN but from the alternative media like the following articles:

    Barack Obama and the End of Racism
    http://the-fourth-world.blogspot.com/2008/02/barack-obama-and-end-of-racism.html

    Andrew Sullivan on Obama: The “Best Face” For Imperialism
    http://www.assatashakur.org/forum/open-forum/27702-andrew-sullivan-obama-best-face-imperialism.html

    Barack Obama: Faithful Tool of Imperialism and Empire
    http://www.blackcommentator.com/271/271_kir_obama_tool_us_imperialism.html

    Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 7:26 pm ¶

13. Dat Homie wrote:

    I agree with JJ that Obama was giving the same old, tired, condescending “We’ve got to do better” speech that black people have heard a million times over.

    Look, I’ll still for for Obama, but he’s not a “black leader” to me, and I take his comments towards our community in the same vein as I would if they came from Hillary Clinton or some other white person of power.

    Posted 11 Jul 2008 at 9:37 pm ¶

14. Renee wrote:

    I really believe that Jesse Jackson was reacting to what he perceive as a loss of power and influence. Jesse has become used to a lifetime of speaking for the black community and a new voice of authority is threatening to him. Notice that the comment was about emasculating Obama, thus usurping his power. No one ever gives up power willingly and I feel that we are going to seem more guffaws from Jackson as he is led of stage.

    Posted 12 Jul 2008 at 5:46 am ¶

15. cw wrote:

    What’s the big deal about Jesse Jackson’s comments about Obama. He(Jesse) did not gain any points or lose any points by what he said. Oh, and also I agree with Coco’s view on the term African-American.

    Posted 12 Jul 2008 at 11:37 am ¶

16. Lyonside wrote:

    Mickey:

    >All of our traditions are Southern/Texan. We celebrate Juneteenth with pride.

    As a side note, your “traditions” may not all be exclusively Southern/Texan, there are a lot of similarities in African-American cultures in the US, despite regional differences.

    >Black American describes who I am . I’m Black. I was born in America. The only connection I have with the continent of Africa is an ancestor long since forgotten and skin color.

    Hey, you can self-identify any way that makes sense to you. But there may also be more similarities between long-lost West African cultural traditions and African-American traditions (esp. in the South) than you think. I’m no expert in Southern food, but from what I’ve read, food is one of those cultural aspects that is one of the last things to stay. A lot of what is considered “Southern” food started in the slave quarters, in part due to necessity of using what was available, but also in imitation or half-remembrance of the way a parent, a grandparent, or great-grandparent may have done something. I remember reading some comparisons regarding food preparation types and methods (yams vs. sweet potatoes, for starters), and even some linguistic adaptations. Religious traditions and imagery too in the deep South and Carribbean have West African ties, although often merged and submerged with Christian and Catholic imagery.

    My hunch is that due to segregation and the intense need for many African-Americans to rely on familial ties (since the gov’t and the social order could not be trusted to assist and give you a fair shake, making striking out on your own, cutting ties as it were, very difficult), there may be a lot of similarities that most of us take for granted.

    Posted 12 Jul 2008 at 12:55 pm ¶

17. A. wrote:

    I personally believe that JJ said that for a number of reasons.

    1. JJ has a child from an out of wedlock marriage that he is merely paying child support for, but is not there for her – so this speech did hit home for him. He’s guilty as hell, and he’s speaking out because of it. Additionally, a leader like JJ doesn’t really rally for the issues and situations that black women face. Him and Al Sharpton were damn quiet when the Dunbar Village situation reared it’s ugly head.

    2. I feel that he’s still having a bout of bitterness after his own campaign. What I understand from this is that he did have a legitimate shot, but it was his Hymietown comments that destroyed his chance.

    3. As was stated upthread, this is mainly an issue of Jesse Jackson, someone whom I see as the old-guard, losing his power and influence to a younger generation. And he’s not going to suffer that lightly.

    Posted 12 Jul 2008 at 4:39 pm ¶

18. Eric Daniels wrote:

    I think Tariq is right on the Money with Obama, I don’t trust him or other blacks immirgrants because many talk down to Black Americans. I think Jackson did nothing wrong but speak his peace on Obama’s lack of dialouge with Black Americans. instead of engaging us as a voting bloc he needs to win in November, he lectures Black Men like wayard children and never offers any policy solutions in his speeches but the same spiel he has done for the past 2 years.

    I don’t have any respect for him or Michelle because what Obama will do is what he did in the state of Black America in Febuary and send in Michelle to talk some “down home rhetoric” and tell black people to understand, that is totally patronizing on it’s face and insulting to a people who made it possible for him to win the nomination in the first place. Adolph Reed called Obama a “vaccous opprotunist” and has used Black Americans like soiled toilet paper for his own ambitions. I will vote for Cynthia Mc Kinney because Obama does not represent changein any shape or form, he is Reagan and Clinton with a light tan.

    Posted 12 Jul 2008 at 11:29 pm ¶

19. Mickey wrote:

    @ Lyonside

    You make some good points, but when I look at the food my mom cooks, I don’t see West Africa, the Caribbean, etc. I see America. I see Texas.

    The place I get neck bones right next to my chorizo.

    And I don’t discount that other Black Americans may celebrate some of my “traditons”, but I don’t see Juneteenth being celebrated outside of Texas either.

    Posted 12 Jul 2008 at 11:35 pm ¶

20. Minotaar wrote:

    What I really want to see is Carmen on AC360 regularly!

    Posted 13 Jul 2008 at 6:37 pm ¶