Comments

1. Latoya Peterson wrote:

   *trying to subscribe with her Zen*

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 8:20 am ¶

2. Molly Tennessen wrote:

   You just made my day! I love this podcast!

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 9:11 am ¶

3. Safiya Outlines wrote:

   Woo-Hoo! I am so happy. I loved the podcasts.

   Welcome back.

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 10:58 am ¶

4. The Cruel Secretary wrote:

   @ Carmen–yay! My iPod missed you…

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 12:27 pm ¶

5. Torontonian wrote:

   You guys are so funny! LOL @ “the ultimate prize”.

   I saw Hollywood Chinese too, and it was too awesome. It’s underrated.

   I’m still resentful that Jenn Fang downplays her Canadianness to appeal to the larger, Asian American audience.

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 9:09 pm ¶

6. Latoya Peterson wrote:

   Torontonian -

   I wouldn’t say it’s a downplay, it’s more of yet another US based assumption. I can still remember vividly when a coworker ran up to me saying “Guess who in our company is Canadian!?!?”

   It was a fun secret for him that he wanted to share. Finding out someone is Canadian is like finding extra marshmallows in your Lucky Charms.

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 9:15 pm ¶

7. Torontonian wrote:

   @LP: LOL

   But reappropriate says:

   Reappropriate.com is a personal and political blog written by an angry Asian American woman.

   which makes me feel marginalized by my own people. And she’s also from Scarborough.

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 9:47 pm ¶

8. Latoya Peterson wrote:

   Aw, damn it. I didn’t really register with that. You’ll have to ask Jenn on that count.

   However, I do want to point out that being IDed as Canadian in America just means you’re subjected to really corny jokes about the words “eh” and “a-boot.”

   Ask poor Thea (of Shameless), she had to deal with my ignorant ass in Cambridge.

   LP: Did you say aboot?

   TL: No - that’s a myth man. No one talks like that.

   LP: Awww…

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 9:50 pm ¶

9. Torontonian wrote:

   Yes, I know the jokes that Americans make about Canadians.

   As for ‘aboot’, it has something to do with Canadian Raising and Americans mishearing it as ‘aboot’.

   Posted 06 May 2008 at 9:57 pm ¶

10. Boothe wrote:

    “Ultimate Prize” is the funniest thing I’ve heard all week. ATR is one of my favorite podcasts, and I’m quite happy that it has returned.

    Latoya, you’re right about finding out someone is Canadian. Imagine my surprise when I saw a discussion of Scarborough in this post.

    Posted 07 May 2008 at 12:16 pm ¶

11. Jenn wrote:

    Torontonian,

    I appreciate your comment and respect what you have to say. I am not ashamed of being Canadian — in fact I’m very proud of my citizenship.

    As I write in my “about” page, I call myself Asian American because I see the issues of Asians in Canada and America as linked based on similar Westernized culture. What an Asian Canadian faces as far as day-to-day racism is virtually indistinguishable from what an Asian American faces. Given that the Asian American identity is defined as much by shared external experiences, I feel it is appropriate to call myself “Asian American” in the sense that I am “Asian North American”.

    Second, while I have Canadian citizenship, my political-ness developed exclusively in America. I have been a resident of the U.S. for nearly nine years (and I’m only 25 years old). As a high school student, I was extremely apolitical, and even referred to myself as an “anti-feminist”. It was only during my undergraduate years at Cornell in Ithaca, NY, that I grew into my Asian American political identity.

    I still live in America today, and all of my political interactions have been with the community on this side of the border. So I feel it appropriate to call myself Asian American, instead of Asian Canadian, given these circumstances. Otherwise, I feel I would inappropriately distance myself from the community that has in essence shaped my political beliefs.

    But, I am not hiding my Canadian identity, and am happy to discuss it when it seems relevant to any point. Nonetheless, I do kind of fail to see how my relatioship with my nationality is marginalizing you.

    Incidentally, I was born in Scarborough but my family currently lives in Richmond Hill.

    Thanks for the discussion!

    -Jenn

    Posted 07 May 2008 at 4:07 pm ¶

12. Jenn wrote:

    One more thing: I’ve sadly lost my Canadian accent.

    Posted 07 May 2008 at 4:07 pm ¶

13. Torontonian wrote:

    What an Asian Canadian faces as far as day-to-day racism is virtually indistinguishable from what an Asian American faces.

    I definitely agree.

    I feel it is appropriate to call myself “Asian American” in the sense that I am “Asian North American”.

    That’s the problem. “American” means “of the United States” in Canadian English. “American” is very different from “North American”.

    Nonetheless, I do kind of fail to see how my relatioship with my nationality is marginalizing you.

    I thought that you were downplaying your Canadianness to appeal to a larger, American audience. I thought that because few people care about Canada in general, and even fewer people care about Asian Canadians specifically, you were trying to “market” yourself to appeal to a larger internet audience, at the expense of contributing to the invisibility of Canadians of colour.

    Saying “Asian American” instead of “Asian North American” is catering to Americans, because Canadians wouldn’t think “American” means “North American”. (However, Americans would consider Canada as America’s “51st state”, and have no problem claiming Canada as their own/their property.) You can usually tell someone on the internet is Canadian when they use the term “North America”, so it looks like you are trying to make your Canadianness less visible.

    I was also thinking that maybe you were using the term “Asian American” because “Asian North American” looks/sounds awkward. Also, Americans would be less familiar with the concept of “North American” (which is different from American North), and the strangeness may draw their attention away from the complex arguments you are making about race, etc. Also, Americans may say that as a Canadian, you are not allowed to criticize racist remarks about Asian Americans, or some junk like that. In any case, if you are calling yourself Asian American in response to these issues, it’s just another instance of making things easier for Americans but more difficult for Canadians.

    I mean, on the internet, I have had an American tell me to come visit the United States to marvel at the advanced technology, as if Canadians live in log cabins in the wilderness or in igloos alongside polar bears. It’s really annoying when Americans consider Canada technologically backward and ‘primitive’, so I think it’s important to ‘represent’ Canada.

    Posted 07 May 2008 at 7:38 pm ¶

14. Torontonian wrote:

    I would also like to mention that most of Harold & Kumar Go To White Castle was filmed in Canada. You can see many Canadian things in the movie, like Shopper’s Drug Mart and the University of Toronto.

    Posted 07 May 2008 at 8:36 pm ¶

15. Torontonian wrote:

    *mostly filmed in Canada

    Posted 07 May 2008 at 8:36 pm ¶

16. AnonymousR1 wrote:

    That movie review was awful, she was all over the place. Why did she obsess about the grape soda thing, that was one scene in a 2 hour movie and she goes on and on about it.
    And the “Ultimate Prize” thing is stupid, again did she even SEE the movie? There’s
    a really funny flashback showing why the character falls in love with the girl that was NOT mentioned, it’s not because she’s some kinda “white” prize or something.

    Posted 08 May 2008 at 9:53 am ¶

17. uRB wrote:

    Wait, I’m confused.

    Why is it when the Asian men are paired with non-Asian women, it’s because they’re chasing the “ultimate prize” but when it’s Asian women with white men, it’s because:

    A. It’s a great story line.

    B. He just *happens* to be white. (Ironic since there the women Harold and Kumar are paired with could have been played by any race since there was no mention of them being involved in racial discourse.)

    C.) It’s a wholesome relationship that we should all give the benefit of the doubt, IE: Falling for Grace (where her and his race played a central part of the storyline)?

    It’s like that ever since Asian men have been griping about this issue, when we finally see a different representation that benefits them, it’s automatically viewed as getting revenge.

    Posted 08 May 2008 at 7:51 pm ¶

18. uRB wrote:

    I also wanted to add that the reason why Asian men specifically think this is the “greatest movie ever” might be because it has been so long overdue that they’re pleased with anything that that benefits them.

    The more I see educated discussion about racial politics in this country, it almost always translates into “what benefits my demographic the most” and the whining that follows about who didn’t get something out of the transaction. I’m not sure why Asian women can’t just be happy for Asian men and just sit back and say “grats, guys. You finally got something that specifically benefits you.”

    Posted 08 May 2008 at 7:54 pm ¶

19. Jay wrote:

    I wouldn’t say it’s a downplay, it’s more of yet another US based assumption. I can still remember vividly when a coworker ran up to me saying “Guess who in our company is Canadian!?!?”

    It was a fun secret for him that he wanted to share. Finding out someone is Canadian is like finding extra marshmallows in your Lucky Charms.

    lol.. I’m a Canadian in America now and I do the same thing… find other Canadians.

    @uRB:

    I think it was poking fun at the fact that some Asian-(North) American men do see white women as the “ultimate prize”.

    Posted 08 May 2008 at 8:31 pm ¶

20. AnonymousR1 wrote:

    “I think it was poking fun at the fact that some Asian-(North) American men do see white women as the “ultimate prize”.”

    Which Asian North American men are you talking about? The only Asians or non asians who think that are the (FOB) or “fresh off the boat” type, the kind of person that prob watched a lot of American television in their home country and developed the idea that American white women as ‘easy/slutty’, or being the smiling trophy sitcom housewife. The character of Kumar is from NJ, he’s American kid not a FOB, therefore his ideas of ‘American women’ are going to be a lot different, and therefore he should be able to date/marry ANYONE he wants without people being suspicious that there’s some kind of agenda.

    “When it’s Asian women with white men”

    Yeah nobody says a thing about that. What’s funny about that is I’ve never seen/met an asian women with an asian man in my life, I’m dead serious. Hmmm double standard? I’m not surprised that it’s asian women who think this way, yeah they giggle about “ultimate prize” but if you want to use that logic they’re actually the ones actually more guilty of it. True, I don’t think asian women can be happy for asian guys in any case.

    Posted 09 May 2008 at 8:49 am ¶

21. Torontonian wrote:

    @uRB, AnonymousR1:

    I think Racialicious has already covered problems with Asian women being portrayed as sex objects to fulfill white men’s fantasies. Reappropriate has complained about the Orientalist fetishization of Asian women from a white male gaze. It’s not like there aren’t Asian women who look down on/question why other Asian women are with white guys, wondering if they are have low self-esteem or are self-hating misogynists who are with the type of white man that prefers Asian women because he thinks they are more submissive.

    As an Asian woman, I don’t think all those movies that showed white male, Asian female pairings ever benefitted me. In terms of real-life effects, I’ve had over-aggressive, over-confident white guys who somehow could not get the message that I was not interested in them. (I’m not a mail-order bride in a foreign, developing country that accepts the first white guy that accepts me? Shocking!)

    Posted 13 May 2008 at 11:17 pm ¶

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