Freaking out over Freakonomics

by guest contributor Jae Ran Kim, originally published at Harlow’s Monkey

I was dumbfounded to read Freakonomics author Steven D. Levitt’s response on his NYT blog to a reader’s question about the economic ramifications of international adoption (thanks to durgamom on resist racism for bringing this to my attention). I’ve commented on Levitt before in this post.

Q: What is your opinion on how international adoption affects the economy, race and class divisions, and the widening income gap within the U.S.? What do you think of the argument that children are “readily available for adoption” in the U.S., and, further, that adoption is marketed as a product with benefits?

A: I don’t think international adoption affects the economy in any meaningful way. We are talking about very small numbers of children being adopted from foreign countries into the U.S. each year – perhaps 20,000 children total, compared to the 3 million children born each year in the U.S. Adoption does, however, profoundly affect those families that adopt. My life has been completely changed because of the two daughters my wife and I adopted from China.

You’re right that some people in the U.S. really don’t like foreign adoption. Some have argued that it is a form of subtle racism, in that parents like me will go to China to adopt, but won’t adopt a black child here in the U.S. This is a complex issue – far too complex for me to discuss in all its richness here. But let me at least explain some of the thinking underlying my own decision to adopt from abroad. The first factor was that our son, Andrew, had just died. We were not emotionally prepared to navigate the U.S. adoption scene, which is full of uncertainty for adoptive parents for two reasons: 1) the relative scarcity of healthy but unwanted babies being put up for adoption since the legalization of abortion; and 2) the emphasis on birth parent rights.

We did give some serious thought to adopting either a black child domestically, or adopting from Africa. It turns out that African adoption is extremely complicated, as Madonna discovered the hard way. Ultimately, my own view was that the identity issues faced by a black child raised by white parents would be too difficult. Some of my academic research with Roland Fryer has made clear to me the stark choices that black teens, especially boys, have to make about “who they are.” As a parent, I was not willing to take the chance on loving and raising an adopted child, only to know that when he became a teenager he would have to face the choice of being “black” or “white,” and that either choice would be very costly for him (and also for me). That same sort of racial “all or nothing” choice is not at play for Asian youths in our society.

First of all, Levitt doesn’t really respond to the majority of the reader’s question. He only tackles the economy part in terms of how it affects the overall US economy. Using the average fees for the most well known and respected adoption agency in my state, if adoptive parents paid an average of, say, $20,000 - $25,000 a child then those 20,000+ children adopted from other countries last year add up to $400,000,000 - $500,000,000. We know that not all of this money stays in the United States economy. So, granted, Levitt is correct that this sum is pretty insignificant in terms of how it affects the overall US economy. If you calculate the 108,006 children adopted internationally from 2002 - 2006 at an average of $20,000 per child, that pumps in $1,080,060,000 that pays for adoption workers and adoption agencies. However, Levitt doesn’t mention that the overall “adoption industry” expands way beyond the singular item of agency fees. There are all the post-adoption services provided by agencies, books, those damn t-shirts, culture camps, therapy, trainings, etc. Considering that in 2000, the adoption industry generated 1.5 billion dollars* and prices have only risen exponentially, I argue that Levitt is minimizing the economic impact because, like many of us, it appears unseemly to talk about children in terms of a financial spreadsheet.

Levitt’s response to the next part of the reader’s question really begins to veer away into his own personal rationalizations.

Levitt begins by answering What do you think of the argument that children are “readily available for adoption” in the U.S with:

We were not emotionally prepared to navigate the U.S. adoption scene, which is full of uncertainty for adoptive parents for two reasons: 1) the relative scarcity of healthy but unwanted babies being put up for adoption since the legalization of abortion; and 2) the emphasis on birth parent rights.

First, I couldn’t help but react to the blatant judgmental attitude towards first parents. I really really really really dislike the statement healthy but unwanted which is really really really old-school talk. Children relinquished for adoption are not always unwanted. Many women and men choose or are forced to relinquish for more reasons than can be outlined in this post.

Also, the fact that he is afraid of birth parents rights and uses that terminology suggests that he doesn’t want the messy business of dealing with an open adoption or any chance that birth parents might sabotage his parental authority.

It’s also just plain naive to believe that just because his daughters were born in China that 1) they are completely free of health issues (especially if they were in an orphanage) and 2) that they were somehow more “wanted” than a child relinquished in US (guess he believes the only reason for relinquishment is a heavy-handed government population control policy) and 3) that his child’s Chinese parent(s) won’t ever want to have contact.

At any rate, both of these reasons that Levitt uses to argue why he didn’t adopt domestically seem to emphasize a consumer-based perspective. Classic supply and demand: a lack of supply on the “scarcity of healthy but unwanted babies” and the demands of birth parents vs. adoptive parents.

By the time I got to Levitt’s response to race and class, I was shaking my head at the multiple assumptions he makes and how clearly he is settling down in his comfy white privilege. The response to the question “how international adoption affects race and class divisions, and the widening income gap within the U.S.” was:

As a parent, I was not willing to take the chance on loving and raising an adopted child, only to know that when he became a teenager he would have to face the choice of being “black” or “white,” and that either choice would be very costly for him (and also for me). That same sort of racial “all or nothing” choice is not at play for Asian youths in our society.

Okay, you all know what I’m going to say here. Repeat after me: Asian adoptees are NOT THE OTHER WHITE MEAT.

While I’m glad he recognizes that adopting a black child has significant racial meaning, it’s clear that Levitt is buying into the stereotype that Asians are less “ethnic” and therefore do not have to “choose” whether to be “yellow” or “white.” I guess Levitt missed out on asking me or other Asian Americans about whether or not that is true. Or has he been hanging with the Asian American community as of late? Maybe he knows something about my people that I don’t. Or is he merely more comfortable in perpetuating stereotypes about Asians which superficially seem more along the “model minority myth?” Mr. Levitt, I think you should educate yourself and go read this post or this post.

As for the question, What do you think of the argument . . . that adoption is marketed as a product with benefits?

While this seems like it would be of interest to an economics professor since it’s dealing with a market economy issue, Mr. Levitt apparently decided it wasn’t worth answering. He also didn’t respond to the impact of the ever-widening gap between those who can afford to adopt children from foreign countries versus those who can’t. This is definitely becoming a class issue because of the sheer enormous expense of adopting internationally which continues to increase each year. Which is too bad, because I for one would have been interested in his response.

Overall, I give Mr. Levitt’s answer a D+ considering he really doesn’t address the multiple economic-related questions about international adoption. In terms of dealing with the racial realities of adopting a child from China? I give the professor an F. I think he missed the point completely. I would suggest he read the article cited below from Outsiders Within for extra credit.

*Cited by Kim Park Nelson in Shopping for Children in the International Marketplace in Outsiders Within: Writing on Transracial Adoption by South End Press (2006) p. 94.

Trackbacks & Pings

  1. Body Impolitic - Blog Archive - » Freakopolitics? - Laurie Toby Edison: Photographer on 22 Aug 2008 at 12:03 am

    […] was first to point me at the mixed-race article (also check out Racialicious on the topic) and Kerry found the Australian […]

Comments

  1. atlasien wrote:

    I really liked Freakonomics, especially the chapters on sumo wrestling and drug dealing. But this international adoption stuff is really weak, and offensive to Asian-Americans. If you’re going to write a cold-blooded, ethics-out-of-the-equation, no-feelings-spared-on-any-side analysis of the adoption industry… then just do it already! Instead, Levitt put out a mashed-up ball of insecure justification having almost nothing to do with economics.

  2. Alicia wrote:

    It’s really sad when a black child is seen as such a burden compared to another.

  3. j wrote:

    It’s sad for Levitt - but especially problematic for his Asian daughter - that he doesn’t see Asian as ‘ethnic’ or otherwise bound by racial and ethnic history, culture and fraught with stereotypes. I personally believe that much of the popularity in the upper classes of adopting Asian babies and other international adoptions is a mix of 1) easy adoption process relative to the US process 2) satisfies some ‘exotic’ and liberal impulses 3) while still remaining appropriately ‘white’ in their eyes. To suggest that black teens raised by white parents undergo a racial dilemma that other teens in a similar situation don’t only reflects Levitt’s own ignorance and biases on the issue. If anything, Levitt’s view only reinforces the illusion of ‘black’ as a rigid and limiting social boundary that cannot be overcome or transgressed and of ‘race’ as synonymous with ‘black’.

  4. Celeste wrote:

    Being asian truly is viewed as the next best thing to white. It’s as if asian adoptees have every inclination to identify with the race of their adopted families. He thinks there’s no risk of any identity crisis whatsoever. Yes, he is aware (kinda sorta) of the issues concerning whites adopting black children but he makes this huge assumption that a black child would inevitably reject his parents in order to embrace his or her black identity. I think that transracial adoption by racially insensitive parents would probably cause any prospective child to have more problems with their identity growing up.
    This whole black=difficult (black children are hard to raise, black women are ill-tempered) association needs to stop. He also seems unwaware of all the europeans and canadians that come here to adopt black infants because “healthy unwanted” ones are cheap and plentiful. This reluctance to adopt perfectly normal black infants has really motivated me to adopt a black infant once we’re ready to start a family.

  5. Celeste wrote:

    The third act of this radio broadcast has a really funny but sad at the end story about adoption.

    http://www.thisamericanlife.org/Radio_Episode.aspx?sched=1226

  6. Cynthia wrote:

    On adoption and having an identity crisis: Why don’t people ever talk about people born to immigrant parents who have these problems? It’s always about adoptees whose parents are of a different race or perhaps biracial/multiracial children.

  7. Gregory A. Butler wrote:

    Well, I always knew that Steven Levitt was a liberal racist (just look at the title of his columm and book “Freakanomics”!!! And, beyond the butchered and ungramatical pseudo ebonics to the racist content that fills his writing.).

    This basically confirms that observation - and he’s also willing to use his first world privilige - and his relative affluence - to “buy” himself a couple of babies.

  8. ceecee wrote:

    Angelina Jolie did not have that many problems adopting Zahara!
    and ditto @ Alicia

  9. Thea wrote:

    Hey Cynthia - people actually do talk a lot about identity crises faced by 2nd generation Canadians whose parents are non-white immigrants.

    Google “the immigrant paradox” or “the assimilation paradox” - basically a lot of new research is finding that in terms of both health and feelings of identity/integration, first generation Canadians have been shown to feel more of a sense of belonging in Canada than 2nd generation Canadians. Also there are at least five CanLit books written by 2nd generation Canadians on the subject.

    I actually find there to be very little about mixed race people, particularly mixed race people who are not black and white. Maybe you can point me in the right direction?

  10. Josh wrote:

    Aside from the issues already raised, how incredibly naive is this guy that he thinks that black children get to “choose” to be white just because they were adopted by a white family?

  11. Cynthia wrote:

    I’m not talking about Radical Second Gen Non-White Canuck vs Integrated Immigrant Parent. I’m talking more along the lines of that Tim Hortons commercial where the Chinese Canadian boy (and yes, the family is Chinese. The father said “ming mmm ming back” which means “do you understand” in Cantonese) wanted to play hockey and his dad forced him inside to do homework. I’m talking along the lines of my cousin, who was more or less brainwashed (maybe that’s a very strong word…perhaps I should say conditioned?) into majoring in engineering and that anything other than that is not a good thing. That playing anything but piano, violin and flute is bad. Etc…etc…I could also talk about wanting to go to finishing school and/or be presented as a debutante, but I think that is unique to moi.

  12. Erin wrote:

    I agree wholeheartedly with the points Jae Ran Kim makes in the article.

    I’d also like to point out the subtle stab at abortion Levitt makes:

    “the relative scarcity of healthy but unwanted babies being put up for adoption since the legalization of abortion; ”

    Damn women having control over their reproductive systems! It makes it so much harder for well-to-do men like myself to find a nice, healthy, white baby!

    As an adoptee myself, I’m real tired of babies being treated as products/commodities, as it’s evident Levitt thinks of us. He basically went shopping and when the store didn’t have what he wanted locally, he decided to look overseas.

  13. Erica B. wrote:

    Levitt’s own experiences (and prejudices) are blinding him to some of the economic realities and market forces which are at play in international adoptions.

    Also wanted to note: my in-laws (white) adopted a baby girl from China. Our family’s case is atypical in many ways, so all of this response should be taken with a grain of salt; but here’s a few points that came to mind…

    Financial impact: We have never been told how much they paid in fees during the approval process etc., they did take $10,000 in currency along with them for bribes.

    “Unwanted”: What we were told of her pre-orphanage life is that she was abandoned in the streets of Guangzhou within a week of being born. (There’s no way of knowing whether her birth mother really wanted her or not, obviously.)

    Birth parent rights: Well, Levitt’s right there — the chance of Mindy’s biological mother “coming after her” is ridiculously small. And in some ways, I’m sorry for her because of that; what if she wants to research her past someday?

    Healthy: She’s pretty healthy overall, even though she does have chronic ear infections. My aunt-in-law, a lesbian, co-adopted two Chinese daughters with worse troubles, ending up having to buy special formula for one with serious digestive issues. Overall, quite average.

    (On a side note, I don’t like tying “unhealthy” to “unwanted” the way Levitt did — my friend’s daughter, with Down’s Syndrome, is certainly not less wanted than any other child, despite serious health troubles. Don’t insult mothers by insinuating we will only love perfect babies.)

    Mindy’s race: I think that the primary reason they went to China for a baby was that it’s VERY difficult to be considered as adoptive parents when you’re 55 and have three grown sons already; the Chinese adoption process was such that they could financially grease the wheels more easily than in a local adoption. (This is an opinion; I’m not able to ask because I think my mother-in-law would throw something at me if I pitched that theory. She’s sensitive about the age thing.)

    I think they aren’t trying to make her “white”. She’s taking Chinese classes, for one thing. ([sarcastic]That’ll make her completely Asian, right?[/sarcastic]) But they’re fooling themselves (like Levitt) if they think she won’t be having a few identity crises as she grows up… and they’ll be pushing 70 when she’s a teenager. Interesting years ahead.

  14. Kaonashi wrote:

    He does have a point about the troubles of adopting from the US. Way too many cases of birth moms deciding years later that they actually *do* want their child, suing for custody, and some boneheaded judge agreeing with them.

    I’ve also personally heard of horror stories from friends who have tried to adopt their foster children- only to get strong-armed by the courts and “parents” who don’t mind their kids living in foster care but GOD FORBID someone actually cares about the child enough to want to adopt them! Some of them actually had kids removed from their homes and placed in environments a hell of a lot less safe because the judge thought that the foster parents were “too emotionally invested.” WTF?

    State adoption laws can also be pretty stringent about who can and cannot adopt. If you’re gay, been hospitalized for depression at any age or committed any crime while an adult (no matter how far in the past these events occurred) you can pretty much kiss your chances of adopting goodbye.

    If I ever adopt, it will NOT be from the U.S.

    Note: I’m not talking about situations where the birth parents are trying to get it together (ie: making court dates, taking parenting classes and taking proactive steps to get their child back) and the foster parents decided that they want to adopt that child anyway even though it’s supposely “non-adoptable.” I’m talking about situations where the parents really don’t give a damn, aren’t doing anything to get the child back and the child has been in the foster family for 4+ years.

  15. gatamala wrote:

    As an adoptee myself, I’m real tired of babies being treated as products/commodities, as it’s evident Levitt thinks of us. He basically went shopping and when the store didn’t have what he wanted locally, he decided to look overseas.

    Erin,

    Thanks for sharing that perspective. Sometimes I think the frustration that potential/adoptive parents have from wanting to be parents obscures the fact that they are talking about someone’s life/needs (other than their own).

  16. Mickey wrote:

    Alica:

    I co-sign your statement.

    I am going into social work to disabuse this notion that somehow Black children are damaged goods and do not deserve a loving and caring home.

  17. Thea wrote:

    Not sure I follow you Cynthia. I don’t think academic and health research into the immigrant paradox was only surveying 2nd gen. Canadians (usually Asians) who identified as anti-racist or radical.

    What the research measures is that significant numbers of, for eg, Chinese Canadians - whatever their political beliefs - reported less of a feeling of belonging in Canada than their parents who’d been born elsewhere, and more of a feeling of unease with identity. In other words, extensive academic studies (and art) has been devoted to discussing how (in your terms) “people born to immigrant parents who have identity crises.”

    Research done in the US showed lower rates of health among Asians and Latinos in the US compared to 1st gens.

    Blagh, I never liked that Tim Hortons commercial. It definitely represents an experience that I’m sure is familiar to lots of Chinese Canadian men, but it also perpetuated lazy stereotypes about Chinese families. There was definitely a white gaze feel about it.

  18. Cynthia wrote:

    Thea,

    In my experience and from many other CBCs I know, there has been more racism from people in their own ethnic communities than from the general white Canadian/American community. This includes Asians who join historically white fraternities/sororities, the Junior League (a women’s service group that originated out of Manhattan…historically very “white gloved”), who major in theatre or other fine arts (though music is acceptable), the liberal arts and so forth. Come to think of it, for YASPy /bananas (who, btw, know more about their heritage than many other bananas) like me, the racism comes from the immigrant generation as well as radical Asians who sometimes question the way you are. The studies I’ve seen always talk about the uneasiness of fitting in with so-called white society rather than being proud of who they are and what they like even within their ethnic community. But this might also be a class-related issue.

    YASP: “Yellow” Anglo-Saxon Protestant. Asians who are “culturally” WASP. Mostly Hong Kongers and Singaporeans. They don’t necessarily have to be western-born. Many are immigrants. Usually likes to golf. Those raised in Canada or the US probably have connections to the old-line university preparatory schools (e.g. Trinity College School, UCC, Havergal, etc)

  19. atlasien wrote:

    Kaonashi…

    “If you’re gay, been hospitalized for depression at any age or committed any crime while an adult (no matter how far in the past these events occurred) you can pretty much kiss your chances of adopting goodbye.”

    That’s completely false! I’m adopting from the foster care system. I’m well aware there are tons of problems with the system and it’s not an easy path. However, please don’t spread misinformation about it.

    Private adoption agencies can afford to market their services by claiming they can provide healthy, easy, quick babies with conveniently exported, muted birth parents. Foster care/social services agencies don’t market like that. You get a much more realistic picture with less back-patting. Foster care adoptions are also COMPLETELY FREE, subsidized, and you get extensive training on how to cope with parenting challenges (whereas international agencies go light on the training or forgo it in order to keep up their profit margins).

    Yes, there are plenty of “horror stories” when it comes to foster care adoption, but there are a lot of really beautiful, hopeful stories as well.

    Also, Florida is the only state where gay adoption is banned. In other areas, being gay, lesbian or single will affect your chances to adopt, varying greatly depending on the region, but it’s still very common. I live in a pretty conservative state and I know several gay and lesbian parents who’ve adopted from the foster care system.

    Neither mental illness nor a criminal record is an automatic disqualifier for foster care adoption. We were initially told that if you had an episode of mental illness, you’d need backup psychiatric documentation to show you were currently stable. If you had a criminal record, as long as it was not recent, not violent and didn’t involve offenses towards children, it wouldn’t disqualify you either.

    Again, I’m not a huge foster care adoption evangelizer — I’ve posted extensively on how screwed up the system is and how biased social workers can be — but I really don’t like hearing misinformation spread about it.

  20. Jay wrote:

    Blagh, I never liked that Tim Hortons commercial. It definitely represents an experience that I’m sure is familiar to lots of Chinese Canadian men, but it also perpetuated lazy stereotypes about Chinese families. There was definitely a white gaze feel about it.

    Hmmm, I know the commercial. You’re talking about the discouragement by Chinese parents into “risky” fields like hockey (both in a monetary and injurious sense) and encouragement into “safe” fields like medicine and engineering.

    While it is a stereotype, many immigrant families encourage it as well, not just Chinese ones. And there are commercials that feature Chinese-Canadian (American) families. The Home Depot commercial and the DQ commercial were two of them.

  21. Ratrace wrote:

    I would say that given the small community, relatively shorter and nearly un-recognized history as well as the persistent perpetual foreigner status of and open racist attitudes towards Asians, an Asian adoptee will have far greater identity issues than a Black adoptee. For someone so smart Levitt is a dumbass.

  22. Lisa S wrote:

    “He does have a point about the troubles of adopting from the US. Way too many cases of birth moms deciding years later that they actually *do* want their child, suing for custody, and some boneheaded judge agreeing with them.”

    Do you think this is actually that common of an occurrence? Or the few and far between cases are simply highly publicized?

    What is so wrong with a birthmother having rights? It is important for the child and the birthmother to have connections to each other. Adopting a child is an extremely harrowing experience and it seems very cruel and dehumanizing that people feel that a birthmother should have NO rights.

  23. Kandee wrote:

    Picking between ‘black’ and ‘white’ = picking between ‘bad’ or ‘good’. Thank goodness his children won’t have to make that choice! They can pass for ‘good’.

  24. Torontonian wrote:

    Thea,

    Please give me information about where I can get this study “surveying 2nd gen. Canadians (usually Asians) who identified as anti-racist or radical.” I need to know!

  25. Torontonian wrote:

    Thea,

    Please also tell me what are the “five CanLit books written by 2nd generation Canadians on the subject.” Thanks.

  26. Elizabeth wrote:

    I’m not surprised. His book sucked.

  27. Cynthia C wrote:

    Honestly, the longer Asians continue to perceive themselves as foreign (which many IMMIGRANT ASIANS do…not those born here), the longer non-Asians will perceive ALL ASIANS as foreign. Many immigrant Asians, and to a certain extent second gen, still live a culture very similar to that of the old country, sometimes, only slightly altered. Even if it’s a westernized culture, it’s more old fashioned. You don’t hear of too many white kids who take piano lessons before the age of seven (unless they’re Eastern European). No. More white kids go to soccer or hockey. Overnight summer camp for an Asian kid? Not unless it’s music camp!

  28. Jay wrote:

    Many immigrant Asians, and to a certain extent second gen, still live a culture very similar to that of the old country, sometimes, only slightly altered. Even if it’s a westernized culture, it’s more old fashioned.

    And all this time I thought people wanted to go back to the days of being more “old fashioned”.

    Anyways, I think you’re blaming the victim here, at least partially. You actually think there’s going to be a 100% open arms policy in terms of accepting Immigrant Asians, especially if they speak “broken” English (you evidently haven’t seen college peers complaining incessantly about “bad” English coming from Asian professors - and only Asian professors. I think Jenn from reappropriate actually wrote about this.)

    You don’t hear of too many white kids who take piano lessons before the age of seven (unless they’re Eastern European). No. More white kids go to soccer or hockey.

    I took piano lessons and soccer camp (and other things) when I was little. That must mean I’m Eurasian!

    Changing how you speak will not change others’ perception of you (you’ll just “compliments” on how well you speak English instead). You seem to think it’s a matter of behavioural perception, and I don’t agree.

  29. Thea wrote:

    Torontonian - I tried to find the exact study that I’d heard referenced but couldn’t find it. If you google “the immigrant paradox” lots of stuff comes up. It was probably around last summer that the results of the study came out, so if you look for stuff from 2007 you might find something. A friend of mine actually is about to embark on her Ph.D, looking into why it is that 2nd gen Canadians have been found to feel more uneasy with the Canadian identity than their immigrant parents .

    The results of the study don’t really surprise me - just from my experience as a 2nd gen Canadian as well as seeing how my 2nd gen POC friends feel. Seems like some immigrants retain a strong sense of their home country when they come to Canada as adults, whereas their children get caught in the middle, feeling that they aren’t authentically and totally the race/culture of their parents, but also feeling alienated from Canadian culture because it can be so white-centric and racist. I just really like the fact that it is a study - that people are recognising this is worth talking about.

    The first two CanLit books that jump to mind are A Chorus of Mushrooms by Hiromi Goto, and The Jade Peony by Wayson Choy. The poetry of Dionne Brand, particularly “Land to Light On” is also really amazing (though Brand is 1st gen). I haven’t read the Electrical Field by Kerri Sakamoto but I think it talks about identity. A lot of First Nations writers write about identity, obviously not from an immigrant/2nd gen POV but it’s still really worth checking out: try Thomas King and Richard Van Camp.

  30. Cynthia wrote:

    Jade Peony is kind of out-of-date for 2nd gen Asians who grew up in the late 20th and early 21st century. It’s a great book to read if you want to look at it from a historical perspective, but to me, it’s about as removed from the typical CBC today as say, To Kill a Mockingbird or Jane Eyre. Great to read and learn about, but not something that I would say that the typical Asian Canadian can relate to from a cultural perspective.

    Thea, if you want a more contemporary character, check out my novel, Aspirations. The narrator is white, but one of her best friends is Chinese, and has conflict issues with her (somewhat liberal) parents on topics like dating and moving away.

  31. Cynthia wrote:

    Jay,

    In order to change other people’s perspective, you must change yourself. I’ll admit it here now. I’m in the Junior League. It’s an organization that many people still see as an organization for wealthy white women who don’t work. While some chapters are like that, many aren’t. In fact, we’re trying very hard to change this perspective, and to a certain extent, it’s working. So maybe people will see things differently in a few years. However, I don’t really see this kind of effort necessarily with some Asian communities! Maybe it’s bad PR?

    As for foreign profs: You mean you never hear of people complaining about eastern European profs’s accents?

  32. Sulyp wrote:

    Cynthia, as a longtime fan of this site, I have gotten to “know” many of the frequent commentators here. Though I’m curious as to what draws your attention to Racialicious, the content of your many posts seem to illustrate repeatedly how you are currently aligned/involved with stereotypically “white” groups, behaviors, and clubs. I am not sure what any of that has to do with this current topic. Sometimes you address the topic at hand well, and then stuff like this gets in there:

    “…I could also talk about wanting to go to finishing school and/or be presented as a debutante, but I think that is unique to moi.”

    And I might add, “YASP” is a misnomer, an oxy moron of sorts. If you are ethnically Asian, you are not Anglo-Saxon by definition. Anglo Saxon is an ethnic group, not a club or behavior. What’s wrong with just being an Asian that likes the things you do? You don’t need some Caucasian-coded qualifier… do you?

    Not out to make you feel bad, but that’s just something I’ve consistently noticed. I enjoy truly enjoy reading everybody’s posts here, and I don’t think any less of yours. ;-)

  33. Cynthia C wrote:

    Sulyp,

    The term “YASP” was not my invention. It was started out as a joke by a guy I know who is also involved in similar activities. Maybe other people just don’t find it funny. In any case, there are people who kind of see WASP as a culture, in addition to an ethnicity. Culture is not the same as ethnicity. Think about it: Lots of people call Grace Kelly the “epitome of WASPiness” Princess Grace was Irish-American….and CATHOLIC. That would make her WCC - White Celtic Catholic. However, she’s very much “culturally WASP.”(even in a time when her religion can have her blackballed from many organizations - apparently, the Junior League turned Rose Kennedy down because she was Irish Catholic)

    In any case, I don’t know if calling myself “banana” is appropriate because Bananas are even more “white-washed” than me - they know next-to-nothing about their culture. Knowing about Chinese culture kind of erases one’s Banananess. Not that there’s anything WRONG with identifying as a Banana.

    There’s nothing wrong with liking these activities, but so many minorities see them as “white.” I have had people criticize me for joining the Junior League, for example. White people won’t do that to your face, because they know that it isn’t polite. But non-whites? Most of the time, it’s a different story.

    I post here because I want to offer another point of view. I get so sick and tired of hearing, especially from the media, all those stories about being disadvantaged, or not being “Canadian/American” enough or that this or that is racist (when there could be another side to the story).

  34. Kaonashi wrote:

    Lisa: I live in IL, and at least here it’s common enough that I would NEVER want to adopt from the States. And no, I don’t think that the rights of the birth mother should include being able to uproot their child from the only home they’ve known after adoption papers are signed.

    Atlasien: Just to clear things up, I was referring to traditonal adoption, NOT adoption from the foster care system. I know a few gay couples myself who have adopted foster children, after being turned down at other adoption agencies again and again. Also, keep in mind things vary from state to state so your experiences might very well be different; IMO IL has a big ball of mess of a foster care system. -_- Here’s wishing you the best of luck, and hope you’re one of the success stories! ^^

    And is it just me, or is there a lot of hypocrisy over interracial adoption issues in general?

  35. Torontonian wrote:

    Thanks, Thea!

    Sulyp,

    It’s good that Cynthia is here to offer a different point of view, because otherwise we’d be preaching to the converted. However, she seems to be evidence that class trumps race. I probably find her posts more inflammatory than most people would, because she’s a second-gen Chinese-Canadian in Toronto, and it often seems like she is trying to speak for me.

    As for Aspirations, it looks like a book about the lives of rich white people.

  36. Cynthia C wrote:

    Torontonian,

    Actually, Elizabeth (the Chinese girl in Aspirations) plays a much larger role than some of the other white characters.

  37. Thea wrote:

    Torontonian: found it!

    Jeffrey G. Reitz and Rupa Banerjee, “Racial Inequality, Social Cohesion, and Policy Issues in Canada.” In Belonging? Diversity, Recognition and Shared Citizenship in Canada, edited by Keith Banting, Thomas J. Courchene, and F. Leslie Seidle. Montreal: Institute for Research on Public Policy, 2007. Pp. 489-545.

  38. Kaonashi wrote:

    I remembered seeing this article a while ago, so I looked it up to link. Apparently, the number one adopter of Black Babies in the States are Canadian couples.:

    http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/Story?id=547647&page=1

    Interesting read!

  39. Katie Absher wrote:

    Kaonashi wrote:
    “And no, I don’t think that the rights of the birth mother should include being able to uproot their child from the only home they’ve known after adoption papers are signed.”

    Sadly, Kaonashi, that is NOT the only home they’ve known. The first home they “knew” was inside their first mother and that is the first person they recognize and value. When she is taken away, they have to get used to a new home.
    So your argument is invalid in that context.

    First mothers do NOT have the rights that your few select cases of mainstream media cleverly reports.
    No, what about the wonderful promise of “Open Adoption” that many first mothers are trusting enough to believe?
    I believed that and was robbed of my child.
    I was told I would always be a part of his life and I was cut out a short time after.
    Where were my wonderful rights then?

    Guess what, I didn’t have any.
    So, I think you have a rather one dimensional view.

    Guess what else? First mothers and fathers are important.
    I know that adoptive parents would like a clean slate. But the reality for the adoptee is that they have two sets of parents.

    I think some people in their misguided fear decide that international adoption can cut down on the rights of first parents. I think that is a sick logic. I also think it is a horrific example of advantaged, capitalistic people preying on the disadvantaged of the world.

    It is sad that so many families are being severed and so many people could care less.
    They just want to be called Mom and Dad and screw whoever is desperate enough to make it possible for them.

    Even the Bible states that only the wicked snatch the fatherless from the breast for a pledge of grain.

    Sounds like adoption to me.

Post a Comment

Your email is never published nor shared.