Brown and Out of Town: a POC Traveler’s Guide to Racism
by Racialicious special correspondent Wendi Muse
Author’s note: Before anyone jumps all over me, I use “brown” here as a general term for people of African or indigenous American descent, not solely South Asians or Central Americans, though the article discusses issues for all POC travelers, not just the ones with darker skin.
Ah, Madrid.
I had decided that for spring break in 2005, instead of going to Memphis as planned, I’d take a week-long trip to Paris and Madrid instead. After all, in a weird twist of fate, the plane tickets to Europe were only about 100 dollars more than those I had bought to go to the place Elvis and I both called home. I figured as I could speak, read, and understand Spanish and French, I’d be fine. I’d been to Paris before, and loved it, and had heard awesome things about Madrid from my friends, so I thought, “Why not? Just breathe, and take a chance.” So I did, though I wasn’t exactly prepared for the less than warm reception in one of the liveliest cities in the Iberian Peninsula.
Paris was no problem, possibly due in part to the city’s expressed love (read: borderline fetishizing) of black folks (Josephine Baker, anyone?) or the running assumption that I was Moroccan/generally North African and not a black American. Most people just treated me like I was French, before I opened my mouth, of course (despite my perfect French accent, my occasional pause to find vocabulary words from my high school French mental database was a dead give-a-way). No one was rude to me or my friend with whom I went out on occasion (who is half white American, half indigenous Mexican, and clearly “of color”).
Madrid, on the other hand, completely did me in.
On a super basic level, I wasn’t a big fan of the traditional Spanish food, and, instead, flocked to the numerous Middle Eastern restaurants like water in a desert mirage. And though I was only there for three days, these little hole-in-the-wall, family-run eateries ended up being my surrogate safe havens as walking around on the street proved, well, difficult. I would say the city, overall, was far from receptive. While I understood having a pride in being Spanish, or a Mardileño, to be more specific, what I did not understand was why that translated into racism. I faced constant stares, and I mean constant, many of which were steeped in anger or confusion, despite my more than proper attire (I was not one of those fanny pack-wearing, head buried in a map, incapable-of-speaking-the-native-language types of tourists, trust me). I was cat-called, a lot, and though I was conditioned to that from having lived in NYC for four years at that point, what I hadn’t been exposed to was the overtly sexual racist epithets thrown my way (none of which I will repeat here). I tried to search the eyes of other people of color for an explanation. People of Asian descent seemed happy, even moreso there than in Paris. And people clearly from Africa also seemed OK, though I am sure their black skin proved problematic at times (look no further than the Madrid soccer related racism or even the recent Formula One racing incident in Barcelona). It was the somewhat racially ambiguous brown folks who seemed to run into trouble.
El Salvadorans, Guatemalans, Mexicans, and other phentoypically outcast Latin American immigrants (along with black Africans) held lower-echelon jobs and noticeably received stares and a little street harassment as well. Their spoken Spanish was a reminder of Spain’s colonial past that history had erased, glossed over, or simply euphemized, much like textbooks of Japan, the United States, or any nation, and their appearance even more so—typically indigenous and/or African features blending with those of the Spanish conquistadores and settlers of yore rendering many of the Latin American immigrants who had come to Spain in search of work easy to spot. I noticed that Caribbean Latinos and mulatos caught hell too, receiving the same sets of glaring eyes that I did when on public transportation or simply andando a pié.
To put it nicely, it was an awkward existence I led, at best, ceasing my outdoor activities more or less once the sun set because I had been propositioned more than once in the day time, and didn’t want to risk full on sexual assault at night due to my having been assumed to be a prostitute on account of my skin color. The hostel employees (all of Latin American descent) and the falafel bar owners loved me, but they were about the only ones in Madrid who made me feel somewhat human. On the cab ride to the airport, a place where I would later be racially profiled (read: separated from a line of a ton of other people, searched, forced to weigh my carry-on, a small backpack, and made to pay 60 Euros for it being a few kilos overweight on account of an art book I had bought for a friend from the Museo del Prado!), I vowed never to come back and counted down the minutes until I’d return to Paris for my departure to New York.
But during this cab ride, I learned a few things to which I was not initially privy prior to going to Madrid. The cab driver asked me how I liked Madrid, to which I replied, “I liked it, but I don’t think it liked me too much,” which led to our discussing (no kidding) race relations in Spain. The driver, born and raised in Spain, offered a perspective I had not fully considered. He mentioned the abject poverty and limited knowledge of Spanish that plagued African immigrant communities, and in many Spaniards’ minds, the state, as they were paying taxes to support unwelcome refugees. He also discussed the cause for my frequent run-ins with men who had less than Puritan intentions in their approach: that many women from the Dominican Republic and North Africa became prostitutes in Madrid to make ends meet. His explanation for the differing treatment of Asians vs. people of indigenous or African descent boiled down to the ability to assimilate.
“They come here already speaking Spanish,” he said. “. . . and with money” he added. He didn’t agree with how I was treated, and noted that I “seemed fine,” but was sure to note that “a lot of Madrileños aren’t ready for that kind of change. The young people, maybe, but their parents and people my age, not so much. They think they are pure, and forget about the years the Moors were here. They want things to stay the same. Come back in ten years, and maybe things will be better.”
Though I was back in Paris a few hours later, I thought about what he said for a while after that. While comfortably nestled in the plush leather-upholstered seats of the Swiss Air flight back to New York, I wondered if my little trip to Spain would have been different if I possessed a lower level of melanin, or even if I looked noticeably more African instead of bearing an appearance that confused people. Upon returning to the United States, the same friends who had recommended Madrid felt a tinge of regret for not having mentioned “the racism thing” or at least not having forewarned how it may have affected me. In retrospect, they all noted, as whites, they had never thought about it. They had only heard stories, those they had selectively compartmentalized in a place far away in the back of their brains because they didn’t really have to worry about it in Europe or in the United States in the same way, say, someone visually different from the majority would.
The experience and the discussions I had in the aftermath of my time in Madrid made me reflect on the privileges, or lack thereof, we have while traveling. Though I had a bad experience in Madrid, that is not to say every person of color has a comparable story. In fact, I know a few black women who loved Madrid and who have gone back several times, stating that they experienced a few incidents of racism, but mainly that it was more an issue of mistaken national identity than anything else. I think, too, of what the cab driver expressed in relation to his (and, arguably, the city’s) impression of Asians. Even my white friends had expressed a considerable sense of alienation in Madrid at times, not due to language, but mainly in relation to cultural differences or even physical ones (being super tall or Nordic in appearance, you name it). In looking back on the experience and after hearing those of others, I was able to put things more into perspective.
Even I am “privileged” (in a physical sense) in some locations, notably northern and central Brazil, where my appearance did not garner unreasonable attention, many assuming that I was just “one of them.” I even thought of my experiences in the United States. I didn’t feel as if my physically assigned racial characteristics made me stand out in some Brooklyn neighborhoods, whereas my white or Asian-American friends expressed extreme discomfort on account of stares and even statements geared toward them. I find myself losing sight of how powerful my appearance can be at the right place and at the right time, but never forget how much of a burden it can be in other situations.
In reflecting on my previous travel experiences as I prepare for an upcoming trip to Portugal, I began thinking about how many additional things I have to consider as a woman, and, in particular, a person of color before I travel. It’s amazing how many things travel guides leave out when it comes to the treatment a person of color may receive in a certain country, how to react to incidents of racism, or even whether or not what you are experiencing has nothing to do with race and all to do with cultural miscommunication. Though maybe I should expect it by now as many of the travel guide writers are white. Then again, only white people travel, right? (kidding, though on average, whites DO travel more widely and frequently than blacks, at least.. . though, given, this could be due to a series of factors that would lead me into an entirely new post, so I’ll shelve this for now).
Besides consulting the Minority Travel Forum on Rick Steve’s Graffiti Wall with posts from travelers of color (including people involved in interracial relationships, who have adopted children of a different race/ethnicity from their own, etc), which I highly recommend, it’s worth considering the following:
1. The travel guide will most likely leave out information about the reception, or lack thereof, you may experience as a person of color. This includes common words/sayings with which you may not be familiar, but that are actually not racist (i.e. if someone in the Dominican Republic were to call you “negrito” or “indio,” it would not be meant as a racial slur, rather a term of endearment based on your skin color and/or heritage).
2. Expect the unexpected, and don’t go into the situation assuming your experience will match those of your white peers and/or friends and family of color. Your command of the native language, body language, familiarity with the culture, style of dress, etc can alter how you are perceived and treated.
3. Don’t always assume racism is at play. As a result of the history of the United States, people of color and whites alike have been rendered into sensitivity machines, often analyzing things at a level of sociological sophistication that may not be of issue in some other countries. Also, bear in mind that every nation has its own respective history and deals with race and ethnicity accordingly. Don’t attempt to color their history with your own. Think of these things before you jump the gun.
4. Find out what you can do if you ARE a victim of racism. There are several anti-racist groups (i.e. SOS Racismo in Spain and Portugal) that hold workshops and do outreach based on race-related issues. Sites like this may be worth checking out prior to taking a trip.
5. Reconcile your prior experiences with those of the present. The United States and/or your home country more likely than not has witnessed acts of racism, many of which continue. Don’t assume that it’s only the country you are visiting that has problems. If we think of the Amadou Diallo case or the Jena 6 or Vincent Chin, the U.S. is a scary and ugly place for POC too. It doesn’t make racism here or elsewhere any better, but it definitely makes you realize that every country has its problems, so you can’t let a few instances of racism frighten you away.
6. If traveling by yourself and feel threatened as a result of your race/ethnicity, try to remove yourself from the situation, if possible and find a place where you feel more welcome. You may even want to try to get to know other people like yourself in that country, depending on the duration of your stay, to get tips on places to avoid, how to behave in the case of a threat, etc.
7. Do your homework. Before traveling anywhere, ask around and look up information detailing the experiences of people like yourself. As I mentioned before, their experience may not entirely mirror the one in which you are about to partake, but it may offer some helpful advice.
8. Have a good time, despite any adversity you may encounter. If anything, I learned to laugh at the experience in Madrid in retrospect, and in a weird case of Stockholm syndrome, have considered going back one day, though with a friend this time. If you have spent the money to go somewhere else, you might as well try to get as much out of it as you can!
Carmen Van Kerckhove is co-founder and president of 
Cynthia C wrote:
Sometimes, even if you look like you can blend in, you may be made to feel like an outsider, because, well, you are. Lots of people of Chinese descent have gone to China, for school, work or even for pleasure have mentioned that locals often have trouble grasping to the idea that you can be both foreign AND Chinese. They find the western mannerisms odd and perhaps the inability to read, write and/or speak even odder. If a person of Chinese descent speaks the language with a very strong accent, people may give them a funny look. A non-Chinese person with the SAME accent will be commented on how “good” their Chinese is. Hong Kong is an exception to the rule (sort of), because many Hong Kongers know at least one person who was either born abroad or spent enough time abroad to adopt western mannerisms.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 7:46 am ¶
atlasien wrote:
Great write-up!
I don’t have much experience at all in Europe but I’ve traveled a fair amount in Latin America. Peru was the only place I didn’t stand out too much in the city… a lot of people must have thought I was a Japanese-Peruvian.
In South Mexico, especially in the country, I attracted a LOT of attention. I had complete strangers ask to take trophy snapshots with me just to prove they’d met a real live Asian.
There were a fair number of offensive comments and gestures that I reminded myself weren’t meant maliciously, e.g. “my cousin has eyes like yours (pulls up at corners).” I also got used to the fact that I was going to be called a “china” even though I wasn’t Chinese.
The weirdest reaction I got was in South China circa 1990. At train stations or wherever there were street crowds, people would randomly point at me and yell XINCHIANG. A few times, I was actually surrounded by a circle of people all yelling XINCHIANG. My father explained to me that we looked like Uigur-type people from Xinchiang, or Chinese Turkestan (we’re both very tall, square-faced and had a tan). The Xinchiang yelling and pointing wasn’t malicious, it was just extremely loud… I got used to it, although the first couple times I was frankly terrified. For all I knew, they were yelling “BURN THE WITCH”.
The most truly hostile attention I have ever had was Nassau, in the Bahamas. Once, a random woman outside a grocery store scowled and yelled at me, “I can’t tell whether you’re a boy or a girl!” I mean, I was wearing shorts and had a short haircut and no makeup, but I didn’t look particularly butch… I don’t know if it was racial or not, but I have NEVER had so many people be rude to me as in the few days I spent in the Bahamas on my way to Cuba (on the other hand, everyone in Cuba was extremely friendly) .
I think a lot of the comfort level while traveling depends on people’s tolerance for being stared at. I already had a very high stare tolerance. I notice a lot of Americans have a very low tolerance. I don’t have a lot of sympathy for people who travel and complain about sticking out. You can easily stay home and not stick out, especially if you’re a white American… I haven’t had that luxury. But I do have a lot of sympathy for people who are getting real hostile attention. It’s the worst thing in the world knowing that someone you’re in close proximity too automatically hates you, thinks you’re an inferior being and might even cause you physical damage if you’re not careful.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 8:21 am ¶
Latoya Peterson wrote:
Wendi -
I think you need to call Lonely Planet or a black book publisher because you have a goldmine with this one!
I haven’t yet made it outside of the US , but I do hear these stories from my friends who travel. One of my friends is in the Peace Corps, and as she travels around Africa she is subject to things that her white friends are not. There was one instance where she was passing through a border and the guards detained her, thinking that a black woman who looked like she did couldn’t possibly be from America and the passport was forged. It took hours for her to finally convince them that she was American and it was her passport. It drives me crazy to know that I may go abroad and still have that invisible brown skin baggage with me.
Again, thanks for this! I’ll make sure to print it and take it with me when I do finally go abroad.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 8:22 am ¶
Linda wrote:
Wendi, your story seems very similar to the experience I had traveling. I have been to Paris before, and people don’t realize that Paris is actually very diverse, there are many African people, and people of African descent there from the French colonies. My dad lived in Paris for several years before coming to Canada, so I knew what to expect. I find the French more friendly than the Spanish!
When I was in Barcelona I can’t tell you the amount of stares I received. One man on the train to Paris, asked me “where I was from”, I told him Canada and he said “originally”, I said “Canada” (cause that’s were I was raised) he said “no but you’re black you can’t be from Canada.” At that point I walked away. Mind you this man had been hitting on me, in front of his wife and calling me “negra, negra” the whole time on the train.
I find that it’s not just those that are ambiguous, I have family that live in Spain and they say the racism is rampant! It oozes out of every corner. They feel that it is actually getting worse (they have been there since the late 80’s). With the large flow of constant Immigrants coming from Africa, and other parts of the world, many Iberians are becoming upset with their governments lax approach to immigration. There are many cities in Spain where Moroccans have settled (basically squatters) on land and are living there for free. Recently the government has taken some measures (destroying homes) to deter this.
Many Iberians are angry with the privileges that immigrants get, that tax payers are providing ( sounds similar to the debate on illegal immigration going on in the States).
Depending on where you go in Spain, the people look different and treat you different. The people on the islands are a lot more friendly and darker in complexion, compared to the further north you go.
Spain like most European countries has a colonial history and it cuts deep. Most Iberians don’t want to talk about it, and dismiss that fact. Just visit stormfront, and there are plenty of Iberians that will say it how it is. There is a growing movement of white supremacy in Spain. Many Spaniards identify as Iberian so that they are not mistaken for those “other people” (Central and southern Americans)
I think many Americans are oblivious to the fact that racism exists in many European countries and not just in the US. Heck there is a growing movement of fascism and neo-natzi sentiments in Western and Eastern Europe.
My best advice for those traveling is to not travel alone and do your research about the country you are visiting, plus all the stuff that Wendi mentioned in her post.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 9:00 am ¶
Barbara B. wrote:
“It’s the worst thing in the world knowing that someone you’re in close proximity too automatically hates you, thinks you’re an inferior being and might even cause you physical damage if you’re not careful.”
It’s even worse when you experience this every day in the country of your birth.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 11:15 am ¶
technophobicgeek wrote:
As a brown person (from India), I find that what helps a long way is to go the extra mile to learn about the culture and language, and distinguish oneself from the average ‘white’ tourist. It’s amazing how that melts a lot of the stereotypes away for most people. Of course, assholes are assholes.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 12:05 pm ¶
mollypoppins wrote:
Very interesting post. I have spent quite a bit of time in both Paris and Barcelona and as a person of color my experiences in both these cities were very similar to yours. I agree with the previous poster that travel guides pay little to no account to the subject position of travelers and that this can often leave POC facing a rude shock. I too was shocked and appalled by how racist Madrid was. I spent a few days there about four years ago on a business trip and having spent the past few summers in Barcelona was totally unprepared for my reception in the capital. I was stared at, catcalled, given angry looks, ignored when standing in line in museums/stores, second class treatment the whole way - I have to say I have no intention ever of returning to Madrid after this experience. Barcelona is different, in part because the culture is much more Bohemian and youth oriented/the pace of life is much slower what with the beach and all (overall I would have to say go to BCN not Madrid if you’re planning a trip to Spain whether you are a POC or not). Though I had a few unpleasant incidents I felt on the whole that there was more room to breathe. On the downside, life in Barcelona seems absolutely abysmal for many young African women (opportunities seem very limited) and many are involved in the sex trade. It is very disheartening when walking down Las Ramblas (the main strip in BCN) to observe the plethora of very young black women propositioning tourists. So I praise BCN with a caveat, I have no doubt that being perceived as African v. African American influences one’s reception . Of course this is true for Paris as well. One subject position marks you as a tourist with cultural capital, the other as a symbol of the loss of empire and the changing meaning/face of French/Spanish citizenship. Though Paris is a multicultural city and I absolutely love it (!) I recognized my subject position while living there as one of privilege. Being identified as African American as opposed to Sub-Saharan African or North African absolutely affects the way in which one is treated ( I had an absolutely bizarre experience during a cab ride once when a (white) Parisian taxi driver went on a rather lengthy tirade about Africans and Arabs. When in shock I reminded him that he was talking to a black person he brushed this aside with the “oh your different because you’re American, I mean the real blacks” nonsense). Anyone who has read Baldwin or even Manthia Diawara (more recently) knows this type of Parisian racism is well documented. All this is to say that yes a travel guide that attends to these issue is absolutely needed! And I’m glad to have my abhorrent experience in Madrid reaffirmed - I was beginning to think it was just me (well, not glad but you know what I mean).
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 12:59 pm ¶
Blair wrote:
I was totally struck by the similarity in what the cab driver said about immigrant relations in Spain and what’s going on in the U.S. right now. Cynthia C rightly notes the odd dynamic in China: my boyfriend and I visited Shanghai last year. He was born there but has lived in the U.S. since he was 7, dresses like an American and has a long ponytail. He got almost as many stares as me (white)– it was obvious that we were both foreigners. When we visited his family in a small village, I got overwhelming attention from people who had never seen a white person before. However, the attention I got throughout the trip was largely positive or curious. So it was interesting for me to read this because it made me realize that however uncomfortable I may feel travelling abroad, the attention is totally different from what you might experience as a POC in Europe. I will definitely check out that minority travel forum for future travels with my boyfriend, though we didn’t meet any hostility for our interracial relationship in China.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 2:35 pm ¶
CMEdwards wrote:
Hi, all:
Not sure what the policy is about links, but I found this great site on this subject matter at http://www.blacktravels.com/.
It is amazing how different the experience of travel is for people of color than Caucasians, for the most part. I lived in the heart of London for a year and traveled to Scotland, Madrid, Barcelona, Alicante (Spain) and Dublin, Ireland.
I turned 21 in Dublin on March 16th (yes, right before St. Patty’s) and I was nearly attacked by a group of neonazis. Yup, on my birthday. What stuck with me was not the fear of death I felt in those moments, but how my two friends, both White, didn’t think it was that big of a deal. Before crying myself to sleep that night, I heard them talk to each other about it as if I should “just get over it”.
I will say that I was loved in Scotland (I WANT to live to there), and I found Madrid and Barcelona to be very race-concious. I did find that the little city of Alicante, Spain had the most friendly Spainards, perhaps because they were more influenced by the Moors.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 4:15 pm ¶
leo wrote:
I’m an American with West African immigrant parents, and I was in Spain about four years ago. I completely enjoyed every minute of my stay.
I was stared at ALOT. It was definitely something I had to get used. People would actually stop what they were doing to stare at me. It was unbelieveable. But the stares were not hostile. They were mostly just curious. And I didnt get a lot of catcalls, but I was on a buisness trip with male coworker, so that may have been why. I did however get propositioned twice in bar by seeming ly nice guys who wanted to take me sightseeing on their motorcycles.
Interesting place. I would go back. Usually when I talk to ordinary white folk about travel, they’re eager to tell where not to go because ‘those people are racist’.
I’ve been lots of places in the world including countries in Africa and Europe, and I will tell everyone not to let people scare you off from experiencing the world. People are really just people.
On the other hand, the thought of going to Russia scares me:-).
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 4:40 pm ¶
atlasien wrote:
Yep, the stories about racial violence in Russia are totally nuts! Central Asians are getting stabbed to death and African students are practically under a state of siege… I just read a long, frightening post at “Moscow Through Brown Eyes” on that subject.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 5:06 pm ¶
Linda wrote:
CMEdwards, sorry to hear about your experience. I’m not surprised though. There have been incidents where pub patrons have attacked POC as well as interracial couples.
Atlasien, like I said in my post, fascism and neo-natzi sentiments in Europe is on the rise ESPECIALLY in Russia! There was a documentary on the CBC the other day that talked about skin heads murdering, Central, and South West (Azerbaijan) Asians (mostly Muslim).
I wonder if things are just going to continue to get worse.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 7:07 pm ¶
Black Strawberry wrote:
As a child of a mexican mother and American father I tend to pass as a native,if I keep my mouth shut (In France and Mexico) My nickname ad a child was white one. AAAA H SPAIN La Madre Patria (The mother land!) and my mami responds Mejor Huérfano(Better off as an Orphan
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 8:45 pm ¶
Trey wrote:
I studied in Spain last spring and TRUST me that country is definitely racist against black folks. I constantly got stares as well; people would not sit next to me on the bus… I even got stopped walking home one night on a dark street by two supposed ’secret police’ officers asking me for my “papers” like it was 1942 and I was a Jew in Holland. I was pissed. They harassed me for almost 10 minutes before letting me leave.
I studied in southern Spain… Sevilla actually, and I think it’s worst racially than Madrid… I think Madrid is way more progressive than Sevilla. I just felt horrible seeing how the Africans were viewed and treated. My host mom always called me ‘negrito guapo’ (loosely, “handsome black boy”) because she was basically amazed that I was lighter complected than the Africans she had grown accustomed to seeing on the streets.
But yeah, when I read this I immediately began nodding my head… it was a frustration I dealt with daily and I just eventually learned to deal with it and say fuck them!
I remember laughing about it though, thinking, “How am I gonna go to Europe where it’s supposedly more liberal and accepting and feel like it’s more racist here than America!?” They’re just ignorant. It’s no different than the way immigrants are perceived or treated here in the States.
Posted 29 Feb 2008 at 10:27 pm ¶
Nadra wrote:
I visited Barcelona almost 11 years ago. I’m a dark-skinned black woman. I remember being hit on by a Spaniard and also by a guy who I think was Spanish and African. I don’t remember being stared at. In Italy, however, I was constantly being cat-called and told I was “bellissima” by random men. One man even grabbed me by the waist. I was traveling with a Chicana, whom people often mistook for Asian Indian. She attracted far less attention than I did. She even noticed that people kept staring at me. I was also given particularly dirty looks in Dieppe, France. After the trip, I contacted the Let’s Go series but wasn’t allowed to write for them, as they are affiliated with Harvard alumni exclusively, despite being one of the most popular travel guides. It’s problematic if Ivy League grads are doing most of the writing, considering they are much more privileged than the general public.
Posted 01 Mar 2008 at 3:01 am ¶
Kaonashi wrote:
I’ve heard some pretty nasty things about Madrid that pretty much jives with everything that’s been said here. It’s the one place in Europe that I’ll skip, thank you very much. I made a decision a long time ago that I would not spend my dollars nor support the tourist industry of places where the majority of the people seem incapable of treating others with even a grunion of respect, and Madrid is one of those places. Russia’s definitely a no go as well; there was a documentary on Current TV about how the Neo Nazis film themselves killing Asians, Blacks and pretty much everyone who was non-white; it’s terrible and a shame because all the Russian people I know are wonderful people I also have to admit that the majority of them left Russia for damn good reasons too. It’s a mess over there; lawlessness rules and is the norm and not the exception.
With that said, sometimes the attitude you take with you determines what sort of adventure you’ll have while traveling; people who go with an open mind and who attempt to learn the language and don’t pull the “angry American” BS get treated better and have a far better time than people who go thinking that people are going to be nasty to them automatically and who have a chip on their shoulder.
Posted 01 Mar 2008 at 3:31 am ¶
dramelyrique wrote:
When I was fifteen, my friends and I spent a week in Spain. All of us received many cat calls but my POC friend and I received a usual amount of attention compared to our white friends. Men and boys half our age would even follow us around town. Our Spanish friend quietly told me that our POC (Afro-Caribbean American) friend was being targeted because she was Black. She also happened to be light-skinned and I wonder if she would have been treated differently if she had been much darker. (This also reminded me of the perception of “mulattoes” in Latin America.)
I am hapa myself and I’m not sure whether the extra attention was due to my racial mix or because it was unusual to see a person of East Asian descent in Northern Spain. I didn’t see a single Asian or Asian-looking person while I was there and all the tourists were either white Europeans or white Americans.
I don’t know if I would go as far as to describe the experience as traumatizing but it did make me not want to step outside sometimes. It got so bad that one day, I lied about having a headache and stayed inside just so I could avoid going to the crowded beach. Whenever I was alone for just a moment on that beach, the calls, whistles, and comments would intensify and I just didn’t want to deal with it anymore. This was neither my first nor second trip to Europe and I was well aware of the way European men could be more “expressive” toward women than American men. I was used to men approaching me because of my racial background. I was also used to being stared at because it’s something I experience as a minority wherever I go. But this was beyond anything I expected and it makes me sad that whenever I think of Spain, those experiences are what first come to mind.
It was also shocking because I was already so used to racism and yet this somehow got to me more than being called a chink or told to go back home. I think the sexual nature of the attention has something to do with it, and the fact that many of the men yelling and making kissing-noises at me were older than my father and no one even gave them a disapproving look. This also ties to Latoya posts on catcalling and statutory rape, but this comment has already gotten too long..
Anyway, I did meet quite a few locals who were very kind and generous. And I would like to visit again sometime despite the unwanted attention.
Sorry for rambling so much! And thank you for another great post, Team Racialicious.
Posted 01 Mar 2008 at 4:51 am ¶
Lucy wrote:
I think it’s pretty important to point out that in southern europe, especially in spain, street harassment of any sort is simply a whole lot more common than anywhere further north. It’s not part of the northern european sensibility to be overtly aggressive or friendly, so i think in those countries racism is generally better hidden, but i’d also suggest that it’s less rife due to the increased level of education in these countries.
I don’t think you can really lump “europe” into the same block when talking about this kind of thing, and i would absolutely disagree that “fascism and neo-natzi sentiments in Europe is on the rise “- it just gets a lot more coverage these days.
Posted 01 Mar 2008 at 9:34 am ¶
alayni wrote:
thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences. What a sobering reminder of how POCs are viewed by other cultures. I am South Asian American married to a South Asian man who is very light skinned and is often mistaken for white, Middle Eastern, or what have you—anything but Indian—even in India! We travelled in Spain and while I did not experience any of the overt racism mentioned here, I did experience in your face hostility in Russia and Prague. We were buying tickets in the train station and I was all but ignored by the woman at the window. When my spouse went up to the window, he got the tickets without a problem. We also noticed a local couple with the guy being darker skinned (possibly Romany) and the girl blond and speaking Czech, and the girl went up to deal with the officials while the guy hung back.
I don’t know if our experience would h ave been different if we weren’t travelling with backpacks and hostelling it vs staying in high end hotels with other international travellers. Some expats we met told us that my experience was very common and it was how folks in the Czech Republic and Russia are to all non-whites.
Posted 01 Mar 2008 at 1:57 pm ¶
Globalistgirl wrote:
“Also, bear in mind that every nation has its own respective history and deals with race and ethnicity accordingly.”
This is very, very important. Race only exists as a social construction, just like
ethnicity. It only means whatever a culture says it means. Globally speaking, there is no such thing as a coherent black, white or brown experience.
Also, along the same lines - so-called people of color only exist in certain countries as a coherent subject. It doesn’t make sense to talk about “people of color” as opposed to white people when you’re talking about, say, China. That also ties in with both Cynthia’s post and what the cab driver said to the OP, as well as the quote above.
What people assume about you based on what you look like in whatever detail they pay attention to depends completely on country and cultural context. In rural China, you get the stares - including hostile stares, because foreigners are generally evil as we all know - if you’re white. (No one giving evil eyes on the street cares to check whether you’re actually from one of the countries that hurt China any more than evilly staring people in Europe care to check whether you’re a domestic welfare leech.) Children point and say “Look, look, a foreigner!” Even in Beijing, tourists take pictures and ask for you to pose with them. My deshi aquaintances are apparently much less exotic and pass mostly unnoticed, even though they don’t actually look Chinese in the slightest. (My guess is that my aberrant hair color gets people looking in the first place, whereas people don’t take a second look at more black hair.)
It takes a large degree of cosmopolitanism *everywhere* to not notice when people look very different from you, and I don’t think many people worldwide anywhere are that cosmopolitan. White people are not always exceptions to that rule simply because they have created some specific “race” hierarchy in the US where they’re on top, or because large-scale immigration is new historically to Europe.
That brings me back to the importance of the quote I started with. The US is unique in that it was created as a nationstate of immigrants. Very few other countries have ever made any claims to immigrants generally being welcome there in the first place, and therefore if you are not from a country both ethnically and culturally (and most touristis fail both), you are Other. C’est la vie. We are all Other to the majority of the Earth, and that in and of itself isn’t a slap in the face. Most countries other than the US that I’ve lived in or spent a lot of time in construct a sense of nationality on both culture and appearance. That may be objectionable, but it also complicates simple analysis of what is just racist as opposed to xenophobic. You can’t be Chinese and white like you can be American and clearly have Asian genetic descent. I would agree with some posters above that far more concerning and hurtful and irrational is creating internal Others. Being told you don’t belong in your home country is far more painful and traumatic than being told people in a country you’re in only on vacation are suspicious of you, at least in my (third culture) opinion.
Posted 02 Mar 2008 at 3:12 am ¶
bdsista wrote:
Has anyone been to Seville? I was thinking of going there to study Flamenco for amonth. I am light to med (think cappucino) African American woman in her late 40s. The kind who would have the American Embassy on speed dial.
Also wanting to go to India. My Indian friends are dying for me to go. I haven’t heard about many issues in India.
Posted 02 Mar 2008 at 11:51 am ¶
mollypoppins wrote:
While “race may only exist as a social construction,” the fact remains that certain racial narratives transcend geographical boundaries. This is the unfortunate legacy of slavery, colonialism, and neocolonialism. It is also important to keep in mind that belief in white supremacy is not a U.S. specific problem, but rather the cornerstone of imperialism. This means that contemporary xenophobia in Europe is a complex problem and not merely a consequence of a populace new to the concept of “large scale immigration.” For centuries, the West has fashioned its identity in contradistinction to a colonized, racialized other. Part of this meant that Europeans felt they knew the “African, Indian, Oriental, Arab” intimately-this was in fact necessary to consolidate rule. All this means that the “Other” in the European metropolis is not a blank slate. In other words, s/he is not a stranger, but an old acquaintance. So yes, while provincialism may be at work, this does not suggest that it is possible to separate xenophobia from racism (or at the very least colonialist discourse). Lastly, when it comes to race we are marked in numerous ways, often in ways we don’t even realize. Split second judgments are made on the basis of a set of criteria that yes, is based on a specific national and cultural context. But as I mention earlier certain bodies are always and already inscribed by certain transnational narratives and this can not be ignored by clinging to the idea of race as a social construct. This of course, is one of the privileges of whiteness, in most (not all!) cases, one’s body is read the same way. How the nonwhite tourist, or immigrant, is treated is most definitely informed by the ways in which one’s body is read and then inserted into a particular value system, and while this is nation specific, it is still influenced by a larger overarching historical narrative.
Posted 02 Mar 2008 at 2:46 pm ¶
Ms. Four wrote:
What a great post, Wendi. Thanks so much for this.
I wonder if countries near Africa are more racist towards Africans? I’ve seen lots of racism here in Egypt towards black Africans (Egyptians seem to forget they themselves are African as well), and Lebanon has a reputation for being really racist.
Posted 03 Mar 2008 at 2:43 am ¶
renee wrote:
Our lovely hosts and many bartenders excepted, I thought the Madrileno’s were unwarrantedly snotty, but I loved Madrid, the food, the art, the architecture, the Prado ahhh! It was lovely - I had good company and an excellent birthday and was really just glad to be alive and away from the U.S. , just weeks after 9/11. The cab drivers are very kind and understanding. I vaguely remember though Pablo talking about race relations in Madrid and that it wasn’t good, he mostly spoke of the Africans there and how it was a problem immigration wise. I’m not discounting this person’s experience, but you have to learn to disseminate as far as racism and a nasty superior anti-American attitude are concerned.
Posted 03 Mar 2008 at 11:10 am ¶
jmai wrote:
Wendi – thanks for sharing your experiences,
I have to say that racism really puts a damper on my vacations these days. I went to Madrid about a year ago for work – alone and hapa – and wasn’t really into it because of the stares, comments, catcalls, attitudes, assumptions, heavy breathing… etc. None of this was really a surprise. While I understand we can’t lump Europe together in terms of racism – much like how experiences vary across the States – I have pretty much the same experience anywhere I go; Madrid, Florence, Amsterdam, Berlin, even Paris (albeit less acute, maybe because I speak French, maybe because I’m Vietnamese). One would hope that if you were going to be safe from harassment anywhere it would be in more ‘cosmopolitan’ cities.
I’ve been living in London for four years and the physical and verbal harassment hasn’t stopped yet. In the summer I can’t walk home from the bus without someone ‘ching-chonging’ me or asking where the massage parlour is. From research I’ve done with the Thai community, at least I know I’m not alone - try being Thai anywhere in Europe. Bottom line is that women of color are fetishized and sexualized in Europe. There is a certain assumption about the Asian woman (or Oriental beauty, puke) in European countries which isn’t really different to the one at home. I think the difference is at home people are just more likely to keep their mouths shut.
Posted 03 Mar 2008 at 11:11 am ¶
Araja wrote:
I found this article and lots of these comments a relief to read. A Taiwanese-American friend and I (half Thai, half white American) travelled to Spain and were shocked at the blatant racist commentary that went on around us. I also, like Wendi, was amazed at how much people seemed to stare at us. At first I assumed it was because of the way we dressed. But there were lots of people from everywhere, dressed in so many different ways, I can’t imagine that we looked that ridiculous (although maybe…) Anyways, lots of “ching-chong, ” and lots of “arigato!” Also, like Wendi, we experienced the constant catcalling and sexually explicit comments. On two occasions a passing man reached out to “accidently” grope my breast. It was incredibly frustrating and made me want to stay inside.
jmai-England is the only place I’ve been to where I’ve heard explicitly negative comments about my mixed heritage. In other European countries I’ve heard “postive” comments (still demeaning and make me feel ill). I completely agree with your comments.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 4:31 am ¶
Cynthia wrote:
I’d say that cat calls are common in parts continental Europe regardless of the tourist’s ethnicity. My high school used to take kids who take courses in classical studies (history or Latin) to Italy over the spring break, and I’ve heard some (white) girls say that guys whistled at them. I don’t think it’s as common in Paris or Brussels though. Didn’t see any of it happening when I was there.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 9:57 am ¶
Wendi Muse wrote:
sorry, i have to break in and comment here. from what i experienced, they were more than just cat calls, as i explained above. i live in new york city, where cat calls are f r e q u e n t, and sometimes men touch you, so that was nothing new. but i think catcalling is one thing, being told in the street what someone is going to do to you in terms of sexual violence/assault is quite another.
also, due to the fact that racial slurs were used in the speech, there was no other way to interpret it but as racism and verbal assault. i am glad to see that others are adding to the comments here where their experiences so that i know that i am not the only one, but it’s also upsetting to know that it happens frequently.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 10:37 am ¶
Lori wrote:
For anyone interested, I just published a book (debuts today) about my experiences as a Black female living and loving in Spain.
I traveled to Spain in college, was appalled by the racism and vowed never to go back. Then I met my Spanish husband and found myself returning to the South of Spain again and again, always searching for a way to reconcile my feelings of being an outsider and my desire to belong.
The book is called, Kinky Gazpacho: Life, Love & Spain (Atria Books).
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 11:49 am ¶
Orville wrote:
There seems to be this misconception that only exists in the United States that the Spaniards aren’t Europeans when in fact they are. In Europe Spaniards are viewed as white people and see themselves as white. They also have an attitude where Spanish speaking people from other countries are viewed as inferior to them. One of the reasons is due to the fact in Spain they view their Spanish as more authentic then the Spanish spoken in Latin America and other parts of the world.
Spaniards are Europeans although the USA has a bizarre racial system in Spain and Europe the Spaniards are white. Just like other parts of the EU there is incredible racism in Spain against people of colour. Spain has transformed from a poor country in the 1950s to one of the richest countries in the world. Now many immigrants from Latin America, Africa, Caribbean are moving to Spain and some white Spaniards don’t like it one bit because Spain is changing.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 5:01 pm ¶
Wendi Muse wrote:
i don’t think anyone here, or at least, not that i recall, is denying that spaniards are white. but to deal with white supremacy in such a bold way is jarring no matter where it occurs. i think it’s less in assuming that spaniards (or any other group) will be more accepting of people of color, and more in assuming that people will be less rude or boldly racist than they are when one travels abroad.
in the us at least, i feel like the bulk of racism is the kind that’s hard to place your finger on…at least the kind that people experience daily. but in other places, it can be delivered in a more in-your-face way to which relatively few americans are conditioned to, at least those in larger metropolitan areas.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 5:14 pm ¶
Globalistgirl wrote:
To mollypoppins:
While your points are good, it is only true in a limited set of coutries. It had nothing whatsoever to say about how an American of color is treated in Zimbabwe. It says nothing about how Spaniards get treated in Sweden and Finland. (Where they are clearly foreign, I might add.) See what I’m saying? I realize the OP can’t possibly relate stories from every country on Earth, and even every continent could get expensive and time-consuming if it’s just vacation.
But my point is that I was so glad that the OP said that due to different histories, different countries see race and ethnicity differently because so very many Americans can’t see further than the end of their noses when it comes to national culture differences and assume everyone sees race like they do.
In particular, it irritates me because two of my home countries are small European countries that most Americans can’t find on a map or confuse with Switzerland. I get the feeling quite often that Americans (and most Chinese) think that Europe consists of the UK, Germany, France, Italy and Spain. Although I’m not contesting the points you made, I’m saying they do not apply to even all *European* countries. They are very important, but please keep in mind both that the world consists of much more than Europe and the US and that Europe consists of more than five big countries with colonial pasts. My two European countries don’t have a colonial past at all. National identities were constructed as opposed to Continental Europeans. A line from a Finnish song comes to mind that goes (speaking of pre-Maastricht days) “…and then there were no European clothes stores…”. People used to say things like “We’re going to Europe for vacation” even when I was a kid, before the EU. (Continental Europe as opposed to Finland.)
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 9:24 pm ¶
Globalistgirl wrote:
Wendi wrote:
“but in other places, it can be delivered in a more in-your-face way to which relatively few americans are conditioned to, at least those in larger metropolitan areas.”
Can’t speak about Spain, but a really obvious difference I’ve observed is the neonazis. Supposedly there are neonazis in the US as well, but I’ve never seen a single one here. I went to school with them in Sweden. Lovely bunch of people, they are. Their leader brought a butterfly knife to school and would flick it in and out white waiting for class. Looking non-foreign didn’t reassure me he wouldn’t stab me for fun, or for being too studious and un-cool. You see the stabbings and sometimes even shootings of foreigners (always foreigners who are physically different) in the news. I ran into a bunch who threw a friend of mine into a phone booth. (my friend was white as well).
Even though a minority of people are going to be willing to stab other people for any reason, I’ve never heard or seen anything like those hate crimes here in the US.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 9:39 pm ¶
dramelyrique wrote:
“I’m not discounting this person’s experience, but you have to learn to disseminate as far as racism and a nasty superior anti-American attitude are concerned.”
In my experience, most do not even realize that I am American because I am a POC. This is a pretty common experience for many POCs. And considering the sexual nature of the comments , accompanied by racial slurs as Wendi pointed out, I really doubt Anti-American sentiment has anything to do with it.
By the way, I visited Spain before 9/11 and before Bush became president. I didn’t encounter any superior attitudes unless we’re talking Basque attitudes toward the Spanish since this was Basque country, afterall.
Posted 04 Mar 2008 at 10:00 pm ¶
mollypoppins wrote:
To Globalist Girl:
My point was that *certain* raced bodies are inscribed by particular (and transhistorical) racial narratives, and this is especially true for black women. This means that yes, it is possible for persons of color to be discriminated against in Sub-Saharan African countries (one poster above cites the example of an African American friend detained in an African country by immigration authorities while her (white) friends sailed by). And while (of course) I do realize that Europe consists of far more than the former colonial powers, these are the nations where most of what you call large scale immigration is taking place; I was merely trying to suggest that in these locales it is not so easy to separate xenophobia from racism. Lastly much of the globe, not simply the former imperial powers, or even the West, view Africa, Asia, and Latin America through a prism informed by colonialist discourse (this includes many that reside in these regions themselves!) All this is to say that even if “national identities were constructed in opposition to Continental European identities,” in some European nations as you suggest, this does not mean citizens in these countries were/are impervious to overarching racial narratives. When I traveled to the Soviet Union in the early nineties, I visited a town that I was apparently the first black person to ever set foot in. Judging from the comments above, such a trip would be impossible today-at least if I wanted to keep my skull intact! Anyway, this did not mean that the townspeople were immune to racism, or unfamiliar with “American” ideas of race-they certainly had well formed notions about what they thought I should be like. And though my reception was malice free (unlike in Madrid) I was definitely othered in a similar way). Sadly, there is no place on the globe that is impervious to this claptrap, it is just a matter of degree and type. That being said, obviously some places are better than others, and it is important to make distinctions, and to be informed, even while keeping your mind open. Nobody wants to spend good hard money on a vacation only to be insulted or abused!
Posted 05 Mar 2008 at 1:54 am ¶
Globalistgirl wrote:
To mollypoppins:
“I was merely trying to suggest that in these locales it is not so easy to separate xenophobia from racism.”
I guess we’re not really in disagreement, but I got the feeling that perhaps we half triggered each other’s pre-existing annoyances with other people’s perceptions of our respective situations. Just in case you’re like me and you think about blog posts and comments seriously and might worry about those that you find disturbing, I’ll point out that I wasn’t saying that racism in Europe is *all* xenophobia, but rather what you’re saying from the outsider angle - that they indeed can’t be separated, much much less than they can inside the US. You have to figure out what ratio of “pure” racism and xenophobia any particular place has in a way that really requires cultural knowledge. On the Internet, no one knows you’re more aware than others. I’m sorry I lumped you in with the navel-gazers.
You seem like a well-read person - would you happen to have a reference handy for learning about ex-colonial powers relating to POC as already familiar? The way you put it made me wonder if whether or not a European country was a colonial power is a general predictor of how race is defined and handled beyond my own experience. To be honest, I don’t see colonial narratives shaping ideas about skin color and identity in Sweden the way I can see them doing so in Spain, due to things like my grandmother being completely fascinated by that a Black adopted baby in Sweden was “Completely brown! Completely brown!”. But I can never know whether my own observations are enough to tell the whole truth, or whether I just haven’t put two and two together because I am a so-called hidden immigrant in Sweden (I look Swedish, but don’t necessarily think like them) and my struggles with outsiderness there are completely culture-related. So, if you had any books or articles you could recommend on the subject, I’d be very interested. Or for that matter, if anyone else has a favorite book or article on how colonialism has shaped ideas about race outside the US, I’d love to hear about it.
Posted 05 Mar 2008 at 12:41 pm ¶
kenny wrote:
Hearing stories like this make me not want to travel to Spain. I considered Spain my next European vacation. Your experience with Spain is how I felt about Austria. The first time I went to Austria was great but the second time around while traveling in Salzburg & Vienna, I felt serious tension.
While staying in Vienna, I asked my hosts (who were British) what the deal was with the hostility. I told them my story of some random “polizei” asking to see my passport, while there were two Asian-American chicks on the same train with me and they did not ask for their ID.
What I was told was that Eastern Europeans & Africans were not well-liked because they were the main ones caught up in certain crimes according to the Austrian society. So in other words, minorities were hassled ALOT.
Not a good feeling when you spend your hard earned money to enjoy a decent vacation abroad. Ignorance is ignorance & I’m amazed at how clueless many people are about other cultures other than fear & stereotypes.
Posted 05 Mar 2008 at 7:03 pm ¶
Josh wrote:
MollyPoppins is ignorant. European imperialism relied almost entirely on native collaborators. Native Asians, Africans, and Pacific states were participants in the process and native people were its exploiters and manipulators, as well as its victims. Without native help in policing and administration, the western colonial empires could never have functioned.
Also,the process did not end where white rule ended, and some instances probably happened independently of white imitative. For example, the reforming of Japan and Egypt, the success of Ethiopia in the scramble for Africa, and the Sioux’s efforts to create an empire in North American prairie.
Posted 08 Mar 2008 at 3:04 am ¶
Shaun Witten wrote:
I found this really informative. Few travel guides (notably the Rough Guides) mention where people of color should be cautious. A close friend, of Honduran descent described a hostile reception during a trip to Madrid. As a black American male, I have had mostly good experiences in my travels. There was one nasty guest in my Salzburg hotel; most Salzburgers were very nice. My experience is either kindness, being invisible and not noticed, or being feared - people keeping their distance. Frankly, I experience more racism in U.S. suburbia than I have traveling abroad.
Posted 08 Mar 2008 at 4:31 pm ¶
twillis wrote:
I visited Sevilla , Spain for one week in January of this year. I am a caramel complexioned, 57 year old African-American woman. (Embassy on speed dial at this age and with the state of the world these days)
Wandering the streets and sitesof Sevilla for the most part I was invisible. I never felt threatened or stared at.
Now the other side, my host (male priest) was rude, snappy, short tempered and not happy with his assignment to be spending time with me. I sensed it from the time we met at the airport as being perceived inferior. This changed when I began speaking with others. Not unlike the surprise by whites in America when they discover an articulate black woman capable of gramaticaly correct sentences. Another side, on departure the priest made a point of re-directing my double kiss to a full frontal hug or attempted massage.
In Sevilla I did encounter two African imigrants, just us 3 POC.
Anti-Semitism, racism are alive and well in this closed society.
Posted 18 Apr 2008 at 9:57 pm ¶
anonymous wrote:
I always got the impression that Europe was a little more liberal than the U.S. in the past because a lot of the people coming there from other parts of the world were entertainers,students or folks with money. The immigrants were also treated better than domestic minorities-Roma and Jews- because there was no history of domestic oppression toward those immigrant groups unlike the Roma and Jews.For that reason, Europeans also had sympathy for immigrants in a way they didn’t have for mistreated domestic minorities. But I know that is not the case today.They are not even pretending today!Europeans everywhere are more intimidated by minorities now because a lot of the immigrants come from post-colonial countries and are willing to work for sub-par wages and substandard working conditions in comparison to the local population. Just like U.S. immigrants. I am not surprised by any of this though. I am just surprised that people were not confronted with this degree of racism earlier. Which is not good.Anyway, I agree with a poster that the problems people of color face are largely related to white supremacy. I do not think it is just that. I also believe xenophobia is a huge factor in how foreign visitors are received; but I think racism trumps xenophobia more in alot of instances in reference to people of color! I also wanted to say that the person saying Molly Poppins is ignorant is not right. Those countries conquered by Europe has to contend with both European and colonial elites-often times with the ethnic elite given influence by Europeans at the expense of their own countrymen; even when the natives of a country protested members of their own elite. The hands of the European colonialists are not clean!
I am not surprised at P.O.C. people from Western countries being treated by their P.O.C. countrymen from other places because they have stereotypes of their cousins in Western countries and they usually tend to have resentment of Westerners. Just like some of us more Westernized P.O.C. having stereotypes of their counterparts in our home countries too!It is a shame. I would hope that I would not use this information to discourage me from going abroad, but folks should know what to expect so as to survive and deal with it better. Which is what I think other people want. If folks are deterred from going places, I don’t blame them! Why go half way around the globe to get treated bad when you can get that at home! Why pay people for the priviledge to do this when you can change this slightly by reducing tourism which hurts the host countries coffers by reducing their wealth?
Posted 25 Apr 2008 at 8:21 pm ¶
lightskin wrote:
I currently am living in Tuscany with my Italian husband and son. I am American Indian, black and almost six feet tall and slender. I cannot tell you how evil I have become from the constant stare from both Italian men and women. It is not that there are no people of color here. There are black Africans all over the place but no one gives them a second look. However, when the light skinned woman walks in, there are stares. I feel like Damien from the omen. I can almost hear that choral chant whenever I am out and about in town. Especially when people turn around and keep staring. Thus, the evil New York defensive side has reared her head and it ain’t pretty. When I catch people staring, I stare back. If they continue, I ask them what’s the problem? They are usually caught off guard and actually look a little intimidated. I also make a point of cracking my knuckles when females stare, giving them a reminder of Ali’s daughter. Of course I only do this when I get dirty looks from people. I am fortunate that although I am a woman, I don’t look like the type of person who is to be messed with, so I have not been followed. I don’t mind them saying that I look like a young Whitney Houston which I have heard but I do mind the intrusion when I am trying to eat my food.
Unfortunately, there are a lot of prostitutes from the Dominican Republic and Brazil who come over and work specifically in the sex trade. Most of them are indeed light skinned. It brakes my heart that light skinned women are perceived as such. I was very careful about not coloring Italy with my history as a black American. The first time someone asked me where I was from and I replied America, they asked me but where did I come from before America? Sometimes, depending on how I wear my hair, I can look a little more foreign than I need to. Thus, I wear my hair off of the face, so they can really look. I never go out looking less than I would for a casual day in Manhattan and when I walk, I hold my head up high and with pride. No one is going to make me feel unwelcome in this world. I am citizen of the earth. I served in the U.S. Army for nine years, and I am a degreed professional. Whether or not I am in some small town in Wisconsin, where they stare or in Tuscany, people are going to respect me!
Posted 30 Apr 2008 at 9:21 am ¶
twillis wrote:
Dear light skin,
As a NY native I hear you, the bahaviors get old very fast. Also, black women in many countries are perceived as being loose/easy.
We are thought to be prostitutes or mistress material. I am 5′10″. at 57 I will not make the 6 feet hoped for in my youth. Lucky you!
After celebating liturgy that Sunday, I went for a walk in the park wearing my clergy collar. That was the only time older men stopped, followed me with the eyes and stared. I inquired of the priest with me who was wathching them watch me, why are they staring ? His answer was, they have never seen a female priest before. The women - young or old, the young men paid no attention to me. Just the older men .
Spain, particularly small towns are patriarchal.
Posted 30 Apr 2008 at 7:49 pm ¶
abw wrote:
No one is going to make me feel unwelcome in this world!
I feel you, when I want to do things, I find ways to do, or try to do them, but my disgust is more from the standpoint of the boycott of -why give you my money to treat me like dirt. I would rather not support you to encourage you to act right than support you and constantly get shafted!
Posted 11 May 2008 at 11:16 pm ¶
Chris A. wrote:
I’m a black male age 32, about the same complexion as Kobe Bryant. I have only been to Barcelona while in Spain, and I got a weird vibe there. Just something I could sense in the air, and it just made me uncomfortable at times. When in the more touristy areas like La Rambla and the beaches, I didn’t feel any problems, but when I wandered off the tourist path a bit walking through more ordinary neighborhoods, I would catch some looks. I was backpacking through Europe and my plan was to leave for Madrid from Barcelona, then make my way back to London for the flight home. I felt uncomfortable in Spain to the point that I decided to skip Madrid and go to Amsterdam instead where I had a great time. For whatever reason, N. Europeans are more receptive of blacks than S. Europeans. I am still willing to give Spain another try. I can say that Spain is an absolutely beautiful country. The terrain reminds me much of my native California, except with a very old culture. I love the architecture, Spanish architecture is my favorite, especially with the moorish influences. I adore flamenco music and I think Barcelona is about as perfect a city as you can get with it’s great public transit, nice weather, beaches, nightlife, etc. So I will definitely be back, I just know what to expect. Based on what other blacks have said, I don’t feel any regrets skipping Madrid. I hate to think there is any place on earth I should be afraid of visiting because of my skin color. Perhaps one day I’ll do it just for the challenge of doing it. On another note, I was pleasantly surprised by Italy when I visited a couple years ago. I know they have a lot of problems with illegal immigration from black Africans so I didn’t know if that would carry over to black Americans. I did not get any stares from Italians, or no rude treatment. I travelled from Rome, to Florence, to Cinque Terre on the Riviera coast to Florence. I didn’t feel any hostility from Italian people whatsoever. I’d go back in a heartbeat. I’ve heard some not so things about Southern Italy and Sicily on the other hand, but Northern and Central Italy are just fine. I did have a hostel owner, an old guy ask me where I was from, he thought I was Somali for some reason. I told him “Americano” and then he asked where my parents were from, I said, “Americano” and he said, and your grandparents, and I said, “Americano”. And he threw his hands in the air like to say, “I give up” and started laughing. I laughed to. I didn’t take any offense to it, thought it was almost cute, and the guy was very friendly and helpful overall. I just think that perhaps Italians don’t know much of American history and don’t realize that blacks have been in America as long as whites have. The only time I experienced racism was interestingly from white Americans. When in Cinque Terre, there were a couple white females(from Seattle) that were staying in my hostel. I usually make friends with my hostel mates and then have people to go out and eat with or wander around. So here I was, a black dude walking through a small town in Italy with 2 attractive young white females. Well, I didn’t notice much staring from the Italians, but noticed lots of double takes from the American tourists. And I knew they were American tourist because they’d be walking in groups and have shorts, white socks pulled up and their Rick Steve’s guide books. In fact, if you want to get away from American tourists, I’d say stay away from Cinque Terre, more Americans there than Italians. So anyways, the moral of story is, African-Americans, visit Italy instead of Spain if you want to go to a Mediterranean country!
Posted 17 Jul 2008 at 3:28 am ¶
Ctc wrote:
This is my first time coming across this post, so i apologize beforehand if i repeat anything. First of all, this has been a very interesting and eye-opening read, so props to all of you who have left responses. I feel like alot of the questions I’ve had but never said out loud have been addressed.
Personally I have always had this urge and desire to travel the world. I’ve been to a few places but never anywhere where I was out of my element; meaning where english wasnt spoken. But due to maybe my own personal issues, I have been afraid to make to that leap and visit europe and south america because of how I might be treated as a black male.
I come from an east african background, so with that being said I know how african immigrants are treated specifically in europe, and I’m worried it will be an issue for myself. But at the same time I’m 100% american in how i act/talk and dont really view myself as anything else.. So I dont if its benefical to actively act “more” american for my own safety and enjoyment. And these racial interactions are never addressed by travel websites and tv shows, its always from the caucasian p.o.v., so there is no basis on what to expect… Also I feel as if white tourists probably get a pass when it comes to the language barrier and are more accepted by the locals or atleast more tolerated.. I could definitely see myself in a situation where I wouldnt know how to say something and being completely ignored or played..
Therefore i’m hesitant to travel to a country where I dont speak the language and I am unable to communicate, and also worry about how I will be treated based on my racial/cultural make-up.
Nonetheless, i guess its refreshing to hear people similar to myself, speak on their experiences traveling abroad. I appreciate everyone’s input. Hopefully one day I’ll have the courage to go ahead and see the places ive always wanted to see…
Posted 19 Aug 2008 at 2:22 pm ¶